fairy lights danger

[ericmark]

Where I work, every bit of electrical equipment needs to be on a register and have been tested and inspected, records kept of this, and a label attached to say what its plant number is when tested and when next test is due. Loosely called PAT testing.

In the home rental in England the landlord has to test all fixed equipment, items like the central heating, immersion heater, cooker, extraction fans etc. There is some debate about equipment not normally moved but plugged in rather than hard wired, like washing machine, tumble drier, fridge/freezer, reading the new landlord law it depends on who's interpretation one uses. The official guide does not seem to follow the actual regulations/law and it is the definition given in this law which is what we need to follow which says

“electrical installation” means fixed electrical cables or fixed electrical equipment located on the consumer’s side of the electricity supply meter;

what we are looking at is what does "fixed electrical equipment" include?

Where the location for use is fixed due to water supplies, waste pipes and electrical sockets even if it can be moved for maintenance if it weighs over the limit to be considered portable (18 kg) and not provided with wheels, then it is likely considered as fixed, so must be tested every 5 years and the results given to the tenant.

But can't see how any Christmas lights come under this? The problem is if you go down the PAT testing route, it becomes rather expensive, an inspector can likely test between 50 and 100 items per day, at £20 an hour, so £1.60 per item, I would suggest that is not a route most landlord

 

[JohnW2]

In the home rental in England the landlord has to test all fixed equipment, items like the central heating, immersion heater, cooker, extraction fans etc. There is some debate about equipment not normally moved but plugged in rather than hard wired,

The uncertainties regarding the scope of the inspection which you go on to discuss are one of the unsatisfactory aspects of the legislation, but they only relate to the inspection that has to be undertaken ('routinely') at least once every every years. The legislation says nothing about a requirement for things appearing 'between routine inspections' (like Christmas lights or 'a new fridge').

The requirements of the legislation (unclear though they are) are therefore of no relevance to the OP's issue/concerns.

Kind Regards, John

 

[FrodoOne]

The UK and Australia seem to have similar "regulations" in that "Fairy Lights" (now usually LEDs) must operate on "Extra Low Voltage" (for human safety considerations.)

While some (most) of the "Power Supplies/Controllers for these do not have a (BS 1363) "Fused Plug" connection, there will be a "current limiting device" contained within them,
if they are allowed to be sold in the UK.

(If imported directly from elsewhere, that may be another story.)

The result of a Short-Circuit on the Extra Low Voltage "feed" to the lights is likely to result in an "operation" of the current limiting device and a "failure" of the Power Supply/Controller.

If the "Short Circuit" is only "brief" (such as having a cat bite through the Extra Low Voltage wiring),
the Power Supply/ Controller is likely to survive and the ELV wiring may be repairable.
(Written from experience of such an incident!).

This markedly contrasts with the situation in North América where (it seems) that "strings" of lights operating on 120 V (AC) are still allowed, both indoors and outdoors.

However, (surprise !) US "Christmas Lights" do have fuses in their "Plugs" !
(See

From 15:20 to 16:15)

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Is there not some over-reaction going on here? Yes, anything which uses electricity will come with some degree of theoretical 'fire risk', and that becomes more of an issue if electricity is being used in a property house whilst it is unoccupied.

That depends upon the build quality of the lights, the fire risk goes up exponentially with poor build quality. The same poor build quality which often see on here, where the advice is to simply place the offending articles in the bin.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

if they are allowed to be sold in the UK.

Exactly, and if they are illegal one, as many are, then all bets are off with regards to their safety.

 

[matz]

thanks for the comments, I will leave her to it. Shes a mid 40s lady with kids so should be responsible enough for what she does, she may or may not have contents ins cover but wont have buildlings cover as thats our responsibility. I will likely write something into her contract for next year.

 

[BlueLoo]

It's interesting how we vary. When there is a paucity of hard information,I tend to 'give the benefit of the doubt' unless/until information appears to the contrary ('innocent until proved guilty'). Others tend to do the opposite - assume ';guilt'unless/until 'innocence '; is proven

Kind Regards, John

When it comes to amateur landlords being amateur i don't give them an inch.
I had the misfortune of renting from one such arsehole and his fudgery damn near killed me.

They put proper landlords to shame.

 

[SUNRAY]

When it comes to amateur landlords being amateur i don't give them an inch.
I had the misfortune of renting from one such arsehole and his fudgery damn near killed me.

They put proper landlords to shame.

As a Landlord myself of only 3-4 properties I would put my self in the amateur category.
As someone working in the electrical industry I find the worst properties are those owned by the bigger companies and housing authorities, those owned by the little guys and managed by a decent agency are usually OK. The fudgery I find is more often than not done by meddling tenants.

There are many running (incorrectly) on 4mm² and a 32A OCPD but all of that is wrong and I hope due to the incompetence of DIYers.
...
During an EICR I found one of my rental properties had a replacement shower unit with the above set-up; on line calculators were happy with 6mm² with some room to spare

 

[big-all]

my thoughts
you need perhaps 350 degrees plus to get ignition with plastic so on say 15-40w on bulbs low risk so melting is more likely on top off that you need flammable material that will easily burn where any flame will form so the most likly failure is melting as burning say paper wont set light to skirting or flooring as not enough stored energy to heat to ignition point
so in general not a reasonable real world worry other than discolouration through heat

 

[plugwash]

The UK and Australia seem to have similar "regulations" in that "Fairy Lights" (now usually LEDs) must operate on "Extra Low Voltage" (for human safety considerations.)

Do you have any source for this claim?

Directly mains powered christmas lights do seem to have largely dissapeard from the UK market, but the impression I got was that was more to do with the general shift away from incandescents than anything to do with christmas lights specifically.

 

[JohnW2]

When it comes to amateur landlords being amateur i don't give them an inch.

That's fair enough, and I would say the same.

However, what I would not usually do is assume that a landlord was an 'amateur' one unless there was some pretty strong evidence to support that asumption.

 

[DetlefSchmitz]

'amateur landlords'. What can that possibly mean? They let their houses for free?

 

[JohnW2]

'amateur landlords'. What can that possibly mean? They let their houses for free?

I can but imagine that it's an attempt to describe 'private', rather than 'commercial' landlords.

However, if some of thee 'commercial landlords' I've come across are anything to go by, I'm not sure I would direct any scathing problems at the 'private' ones!

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

That depends upon the build quality of the lights, the fire risk goes up exponentially with poor build quality. The same poor build quality which often see on here, where the advice is to simply place the offending articles in the bin.

That goes without saying, but what have we been told that indicates that the lights in question are of 'poor build quality'? My comment was a totally general one.

Kind Regards, John

 

[FrodoOne]

Do you have any source for this claim?

Directly mains powered christmas lights do seem to have largely dissapeard from the UK market, but the impression I got was that was more to do with the general shift away from incandescents than anything to do with christmas lights specifically.

Since the 1960s, in the days of incandescent Christmas lights, I have never found any sold here that did not have a Extra Low Voltage transformer (now-a-days, a Switch Mode Power Supply) required to power them.