fire door/health and safety legislation

[^woody^]

There has still not been a definitive post to confirm that propping open a fire door is illegal.

What is prosecuted, is that the act of propping open the door causes, or may cause a certain situation which would be contrary to some or other law.

So, in the case of the door to a cupboard or one to an escape route which I mentioned, the act of propping a fire door is not the issue, its the effects of propping that door which matter.

And its no good linking to a web page and saying that its illegal because this website says so

And its no good quoting health and safety text which could be vaguely interpreted one way or another and contains nothing specific related to fire doors

And its no good quoting cases where companies have been fined for "health and safety" breaches and implying that it was solely because doors were propped open.

It seems that the sole act of propping a door is being confused with wider issues, so there is still no convincing post to state that "the act of propping open a fire door is illegal"

 

[Trazor]

o Breaking a requirement is a crime, whether or not anyone suffers.

 

[megawatt]

I'm not sure why I've bothered to look this up as I always thought it pretty damn obvious but ... Just for Woody and W.DIK ...

A quote from ...

http://www.edp-uk.com/law/legaldefinitions.htm

Health and Safety
So how does all this apply in practice?

First it explains why health and safety law is presented in the form of a number of Acts of Parliament that are supplemented by various Regulations.
Employers (and others) must comply with this Statutory Legislation or risk criminal prosecution for failing to do so.

Another example of a fire risk assessment ...

http://www.devon.gov.uk/sc-feb0657002.pdf

Failure to meet the required standards will result in the Fire Officer issuing you with a Notice to comply or face action under criminal law.

No need to wait until something bad happens ... If they inspect your premises and you are in breach of fire safety regulations you will be criminally prosecuted.

If you still wish to believe something different don't waste our time ... Do your own research as there's plenty out there ... Or phone your local fire service ... They will be more than happy to advise.

MW

 

[megawatt]

There has still not been a definitive post to confirm that propping open a fire door is illegal.

You're obviously the type who wouldn't believe the "mind your head" sign until after you'd knocked yourself unconscious.

Have you had a recent blow to the head at all?

MW

 

[WDIK]

you may reserve you sarcastic and patronising remarks for those who give a fig.

and just for the record Im fully aware that propping open a fire door is an illegal act, unlike your self Im fully aware of duties under the HaSaWa and have been for 34 yrs and dont require patronisation from you.

be as personal as you like water off a ducks back Im afraid.

 

[noseall]

propping open a firedoor is not illegal.

 

[megawatt]

WDIK wrote:

And just for the record Im fully aware that propping open a fire door is an illegal act, unlike your self Im fully aware of duties under the HaSaWa and have been for 34 yrs and dont require patronisation from you.

Oh really?

Then why have you been arguing that it is a civil offence if you are aware of your duties ... You couldn't have been very good at it.

I think you deserve some more patronisation to be honest.

Be as personal as you like water off a ducks back Im afraid.

Okay ... You are *********** as well

Abuse deleted

Noseall: Go away, not rising to your bait I'm afraid ... Trying to go for the longest post again are you

http://www.fire.org.uk/FireNet/doorguard.php

Did you know that propping open fire doors with bins, extinguishers or wedges is illegal and dangerous?

http://www.qub.ac.uk/directorates/E...ocedures/FireSafety/Filetoupload,90564,en.doc

The propping or wedging open of fire doors places the lives of occupants of buildings in danger. It allows smoke to travel into and along escape routes. An occupant attempting to escape along a smoke filled corridor only needs to inhale a very small quantity of the toxic products of combustion to become poisoned, unable to breathe, and in short order – dead. Because of this it is a criminal act to prop or wedge open fire doors. It becomes a double criminal act to use fire extinguishers to prop open fire doors.

MW

 

[^woody^]

Did you know that propping open fire doors with bins, extinguishers or wedges is illegal and dangerous?

MW

Does that mean it is OK to prop them with something else ... say a lot of posts that don't actually prove a supposition?

Your post quotes relates to fire doors on escape routes, which like I said is a different context in terms of Fire and H&S regulations

 

[megawatt]

Mind your head!

 

[noseall]

there are manufacturers of devices that are designed to keep a firedoor open. these devices will only close that door once an alarm has been sounded.

if i were to stand with my foot propped against a firedoor and were to release that door upon hearing an alarm, then what is the difference?

as for you megga whats your problem? longest post WTF?

 

[megawatt]

Now you're just being stupid as this isn't what has been discussed as you are quite aware ...

We are talking about propping open fire doors with something like a wedge or a fire extinguisher which will prevent it closing in the event of a fire.

If you can't contribute something sensible.......

MW

 

[WDIK]

MW I argue that the act and punative recourse for the act of propping a fire door open is illegal and criminal, the act is punnishable under civil law not criminal law.
any occurance resulting from such an act is treated as according to the nature of of the occurance.
if it be death then its manslaughter a criminal offence.
not propping open a fire door, a civil offence.

 

[noseall]

Is it illegal to wedge/prop open a firedoor?

In particular a firedoor which is the main door to an open plan office.

erm who is the stupid one?

 

[tim west]

There is a distinct difference as im sure you really know but are just being funny between wedging/propping a firedoor open and merely holding it open.

As stated before but you obviously didnt register it in your brain a person holding the door open is also doing a policing job at the same time whereas a dead weight or inanimate object such as a fire extinguisher being used is not.

 

[megawatt]

WDIK Wrote:

MW I argue that the act and punative recourse for the act of propping a fire door open is illegal and criminal.

Unfortuately arguing is all you are doing whilst I have posted several links to sites where the act has been clearly identified as criminal.

The act is punnishable under civil law not criminal law.

Says who? ... Try posting something tangible and evidenced rather than your opinion or argument which carries no credence whatsoever.

If you cannot do so there is no point in continuing to contribute to this thread.

MW