Fire fitting possible with this?

[b21playa]

Was there a reason for leaving the old open fire bricks in?

 

[FiremanT]

Was there a reason for leaving the old open fire bricks in?

Was there a fire there before you started? It may have been an inset tray, which typically needs a chair brick, or a slimline inset. which is generally small enough to fit without CB removal.

The big question is why is there a liner? Normally it is because there was a Back Boiler - but that would entail chair brick removal.

My assumption would be that there was a BBU, hence the liner. Then someone removed the BBU to fit an angled inset tray, so had to fit a chair brick. Which would mean the liner is ancient.

 

[b21playa]

NO!

You can only re-use an existing liner if you are confident that the liner will last the lifetime if the new appliance. Which, in this case, you cannot be so. Ergo, that liner needs pulling out.

The position of the liner suggests that it has become detached from its security at the top. Most guys, I suggest, will just pull it out through the room. I NEVER did that - there may well be fibreglass (or even old cement bags) placed to fill the annular space between the liner and the chimney immediately before the terminal. This MUST be removed, otherwise it can block the flue, and will certainly create a resistance. (Pulling through the room is also incredibly messy)

Does the fire REQUIRE a liner ? Most don't.

So: Seal the opening temporarily. Remove the terminal, remove liner (via the roof, if it can be reached, as it has moved). Clear all packing, if present. Determine whether the fire NEEDS a liner and proceed accordingly. If a liner is not a necessity, the flue need to be smoke tested, and visually inspected.

Getting to the terminal is not easy as there was a loft conversion done in the 80s. No flat roof to shoot ladders from, would have to be from patio to chimney pot which is 8m+

 

[b21playa]

Re the liner: some fires demand a liner, but must don't. Some installations require a liner, by virtue of the flue height and whether it is on an external wall. Others, as you intimated, require a liner due to
the condition. But IF the liner is not required, then whip it out.

Your two personally known guys may be excellent, but I stand by most not knowing the rules. (TBF, a lot of actual gas guys don't) My advice was, and is, to find the RGI first, and he will specify the requirements. If the RGI is experienced with fires, he may well have HIS regular "go to" guy, and will avoid any misunderstandings. The last thing the client needs is to pay a "chimney man " to do work that is not required, or worse, unsuitable.

The manual states a liner isn’t necessary, but I’ll let the gas installer do an inspection first, but think it may have to come out through the room. The chimney sweep did say that it may need removing (he cleaned lined) and he’d come back to sweep the chimney and camera it. He did the one at the front and tested draw and gave it a pass. He’s just got to come back to put bird cowls on

 

[b21playa]

Was there a fire there before you started? It may have been an inset tray, which typically needs a chair brick, or a slimline inset. which is generally small enough to fit without CB removal.

The big question is why is there a liner? Normally it is because there was a Back Boiler - but that would entail chair brick removal.

My assumption would be that there was a BBU, hence the liner. Then someone removed the BBU to fit an angled inset tray, so had to fit a chair brick. Which would mean the liner is ancient.

There was no gas fire there and can’t even see a gas pipe. The back was solid and there was an extension lead run behind it for an electric fire.

the other side of this wall is another liner which the old floor standing boiler was connected to. I had the boiler removed when we moved as it wasn’t the best.

No idea how old the liner is, could well be 20+ years old, if it was done at the same time as loft conversion

 

[b21playa]

This is a picture of the rear of the house, you can see the stainless cowls (there are 2)

 

[FiremanT]

The manual states a liner isn’t necessary, but I’ll let the gas installer do an inspection first, but think it may have to come out through the room. The chimney sweep did say that it may need removing (he cleaned lined) and he’d come back to sweep the chimney and camera it. He did the one at the front and tested draw and gave it a pass. He’s just got to come back to put bird cowls on

The one that needs a bird cowl - is that the one where the fire is going?

 

[b21playa]

The one that needs a bird cowl - is that the one where the fire is going?

Yes, but that is a different fire in another room - sorry I realised that was a bit confusing

 

[FiremanT]

Okay. Hopefully your selected RGI will be up to the job - I have seen some nightmares done by alleged pro’s.

The flue that we originally discussed: does the sweeps camera go all the way to the terminal? If not you MUST access the terminal to check for material at the top. Also, terminals are terrible for being full of spider webs. It will pass a flue test but fail the spillage test. Is the terminal suitable for a gas fire? (It probably is).
Is the new photo the original? Can you post a clear pic of that terminal, and how far is it from the flat roof?
On the other flue where a bird cowl is being fitted, this is fir a gas fire? If so, seeeps, on my experience, nearly always fit the wrong ones. They are generally better looking but the openings are too big and allow small birds on.

 

[b21playa]

Okay. Hopefully your selected RGI will be up to the job - I have seen some nightmares done by alleged pro’s.

The flue that we originally discussed: does the sweeps camera go all the way to the terminal? If not you MUST access the terminal to check for material at the top. Also, terminals are terrible for being full of spider webs. It will pass a flue test but fail the spillage test. Is the terminal suitable for a gas fire? (It probably is).
Is the new photo the original? Can you post a clear pic of that terminal, and how far is it from the flat roof?
On the other flue where a bird cowl is being fitted, this is fir a gas fire? If so, seeeps, on my experience, nearly always fit the wrong ones. They are generally better looking but the openings are too big and allow small birds on.

yes the camera went all the way to the top and was clear. The terminal is for gas.

the picture is from when we got the house, don’t think I can get much better due to height. It’s 3m+ from the flat roof of the bay window. I will try in the morning and see if I can get a better picture

the other fire will be gas as well, not sure which type. I will see when he’s back on the 25th

 

[b21playa]

As requested, here’s the best pics I could take with my phone. My camera is yet to be found