Flue picture problem

[Bamber gaspipe]

hmm this looks like it will turn into a decent argument

ill say its classed as AR. the flue and vent defects are both AR seperately but as there are no signs of spillage the two together IMO dont make an ID situation, Immediately dangerous situations are for things that are happening right now, i.e. spillage.

clearly there has been nothing happening to that installation for 25 years so its only AR.

no harm in putting it ID if it gives you the willys but is there anything in the regs that says the two defects must be put as ID?

If it`s incorrectly flued as in not having the right flue it is immediately dangerous. In this case a flexible flue liner fitted to a floor mounted open flued appliance when it should be a rigid flue is ID.

It`s like putting a class 2 terminal on a gas fire. ( look it up boys )

 

[nickso]

hmm this looks like it will turn into a decent argument

ill say its classed as AR. the flue and vent defects are both AR seperately but as there are no signs of spillage the two together IMO dont make an ID situation, Immediately dangerous situations are for things that are happening right now, i.e. spillage.

clearly there has been nothing happening to that installation for 25 years so its only AR.

no harm in putting it ID if it gives you the willys but is there anything in the regs that says the two defects must be put as ID?

If it`s incorrectly flued as in not having the right flue it is immediately dangerous. In this case a flexible flue liner fitted to a floor mounted open flued appliance when it should be a rigid flue is ID.

It`s like putting a class 2 terminal on a gas fire. ( look it up boys )

i thought you were allowed to put a flexi onto a rigid flue in this manner as long as there was a minimum length of liner as possible showing from the chimney (if it is a chimney). 50mm seems to spring to mind.

i shall have amooch on the computer and find out.

flexi liner on a fire is ID i believe.

 

[Bamber gaspipe]

[

flexi liner on a fire is ID i believe.

Looks like I better rip out the last thirty gas fires that I have fitted then Muppet


And on that Bombshell..........

 

[Agile]

That would seem logical as the joint is inspectable.

As far as a gas fire is concerned I think a flexible IS allowable as long as the diameter is suitable ( usually 5" or 6" ) AND its permitted under the MI.

Tony

 

[giblets]

Right, got me thinkin' head back on now.

If it`s incorrectly flued as in not having the right flue it is immediately dangerous. In this case a flexible flue liner fitted to a floor mounted open flued appliance when it should be a rigid flue is ID

From page 41 of the Unsafe Situations Procedure:

Incorect use of flue material e.g. exposed flue liner - NCS

It`s like putting a class 2 terminal on a gas fire.

Unsuitable flue terminals - NCS also page 41

 

[nickso]

[

flexi liner on a fire is ID i believe.

Looks like I better rip out the last thirty gas fires that I have fitted then Muppet


And on that Bombshell..........

sorry i didnt think about what i was typing there what i meant was using a flexi to connect to a precast chimney to a ridge.

 

[Terrywookfit]

How can that installation be NCS?

It has NEVER been to a current standard!!

As my supervisor used to tell me when I was a sprog.

"It costs you nowt to TOFO it and you wont get a *******ing for being cautious"

 

[Bamber gaspipe]

Right, got me thinkin' head back on now.

If it`s incorrectly flued as in not having the right flue it is immediately dangerous. In this case a flexible flue liner fitted to a floor mounted open flued appliance when it should be a rigid flue is ID

From page 41 of the Unsafe Situations Procedure:

Incorect use of flue material e.g. exposed flue liner - NCS

It`s like putting a class 2 terminal on a gas fire.

Unsuitable flue terminals - NCS also page 41

Can`t be ars*ed getting me books out till next exams, thanks for doing it for me, last time I passed mine this was definitely not the case. Will check first thing in the morning. (Not).

 

[nickso]

How can that installation be NCS?

It has NEVER been to a current standard!!

As my supervisor used to tell me when I was a sprog.

"It costs you nowt to TOFO it and you wont get a **** for being cautious"

would cost you a cap.

costs even less to put it at risk.

 

[Clouseau]

Two (or more) NCS do not automatically make an upgrade to AR, but you can justify it as AR if it has two (or more) NCS faults AND you judge there is a potential risk.

Lack of ventilation until August is;
above 90% = acceptable
40-90% of requirement (not in a compartment) = NCS
40-90% of requirement in a compartment = AR
Below 40% = AR
after August
anything below 90% = AR
These are prescribed and not open to your judgement.

So the flue could be NCS or AR, and the lack of ventilation, as described as 0%, is AR.

 

[Bamber gaspipe]

Two (or more) NCS do not automatically make an upgrade to AR, but you can justify it as AR if it has two (or more) NCS faults AND you judge there is a potential risk.

Lack of ventilation until August is;
above 90% = acceptable
40-90% of requirement (not in a compartment) = NCS
40-90% of requirement in a compartment = AR
Below 40% = AR
after August
anything below 90% = AR
These are prescribed and not open to your judgement.

So the flue could be NCS or AR, and the lack of ventilation, as described as 0%, is AR.

Marvellous, wether AR or ID appliance has to be isolated, stop getting all big in your slacks about the phraseology. It`s down to the gas fitter on site, personally if I`m unsure & don`t have the literature any dodgy appliances I class as AR & turn off until I can confirm otherwise.

 

[Slugbabydotcom]

The flue liner is NCS.
The 90deg bend is NCS

Together they make an AR

The lack of ventilation is AR

There is no ID situation unless the flue is spilling POC

The flue liner is NCS.
The 90deg bend is NCS

Together they make an AR

The lack of ventilation is AR

There is no ID situation unless (eg) the flue is spilling POC

(there's an echo in here!)

Am I missing something?

I see a 135º or 45º bend depending how you look at it!

Flue liner NCS

No ventilation currently NCS but will soon be AR .... I would treat as AR anyway

Whether that last sentence was right or wrong its still an AR installation

There is no ID situation unless (eg) the flue is spilling POC

As Bamber says

It`s down to the gas fitter on site

We all have to make judgements and remember that when we use our discretion we must stand by any consequences.

I thought someone would have commented on the asbestos flue bend by now. IMO It's safe as it stands with a nice coat of paint on it but what if there's loose fibres on the inside that drop down through the boiler and give the service engineer mesothelioma in 20 or 30 years time? Unlikely but always a probability.

 

[45bid]

The flue adapter is not 45 degree i would say about 65 degree.

So all in all if i prvided ventallation in a wall it would be ok.

 

[giblets]

Best ask the CORGI who's going to inspect it.

 

[gas4you]

So all in all if i prvided ventallation in a wall it would be ok.

Yes, but do you know how much ventilation too provide? Get a RGI into to sort it out.