How to adjust these flag hinges to lift the bottom of UPVC door up?

[Superpossible]

Hi,

All corners, except the bottom right, of our front uPVC door are aligned with the door frame (pic 3). The bottom right corner is also where noticeable draughts are coming through.

Underneath the 4 hinges on the door are two Allen key sockets (pic 1). There are none on top. One seems to be a compression one. The other seems to move the hinge forwards and backwards.

I have spent the best part of today fiddling with the hinges to try to sort this out. The socket on the right must be compression, as the top and middle part of the door are now very tight - can't get a finger in to pull the door forwards. But the bottom of the door - even when I engage the lock - still isn't as tight and I can pull it towards me a centimetre or two.

How can I bring the door further up? I'm hoping that would fix the draught. Would it be one of the two Allen key sockets , or is there another one elsewhere? There is nothing at the top of the hinges, only a decorative piece. Nothing for me to screw underneath it. Any ideas would be warmly welcome

TIA

 

[crank39]

The outer Allen key is for compression on the hinge side only, the inner allen key lifts the hinge up and thus the door but if your handle is lifted to engage the locks and the door can still be pulled away then that's nothing to do with the hinges, you either need to adjust the locking keepers on the lock side of the door or to start with if the locking mechanism has roller cams then make sure the rollers are going behind the keepers, if they aren't then the door could potentially be adjusted too far over towards the hinge side and needs winding back, the adjustment bolt for sideways lateral adjustment is behind the front cover

These are Trojan Patriot flag hinges, search the site for adjustment of these hinges, I've covered this 100s of times

 

[RandomGrinch]

Additionally to above, if the corner opposite the hinges has dropped, the door may need to be 'toe and heeled'.
Even without a heavy glass panel, my front door has definitely benefited from an adjustment to square it up.

 

[Superpossible]

The outer Allen key is for compression on the hinge side only, the inner allen key lifts the hinge up and thus the door but if your handle is lifted to engage the locks and the door can still be pulled away then that's nothing to do with the hinges, you either need to adjust the locking keepers on the lock side of the door or to start with if the locking mechanism has roller cams then make sure the rollers are going behind the keepers, if they aren't then the door could potentially be adjusted too far over towards the hinge side and needs winding back, the adjustment bolt for sideways lateral adjustment is behind the front cover

These are Trojan Patriot flag hinges, search the site for adjustment of these hinges, I've covered this 100s of times

This is very useful, thank you. Will give it a go tomorrow

 

[Superpossible]

The outer Allen key is for compression on the hinge side only, the inner allen key lifts the hinge up and thus the door but if your handle is lifted to engage the locks and the door can still be pulled away then that's nothing to do with the hinges, you either need to adjust the locking keepers on the lock side of the door or to start with if the locking mechanism has roller cams then make sure the rollers are going behind the keepers, if they aren't then the door could potentially be adjusted too far over towards the hinge side and needs winding back, the adjustment bolt for sideways lateral adjustment is behind the front cover

These are Trojan Patriot flag hinges, search the site for adjustment of these hinges, I've covered this 100s of times

An update - After adjusting sideways, height and compression I think the bottom corner of the door is slightly more tight. However I can still feel a draught in that corner, and the bottom half of the door is still not as tight as the top half.

I wonder if the rubber seals could be the issue. The ones at the bottom of the door seem to be very stiff. The door was fitted in 2015 with minimal maintenance I'm afraid.

I'm going to use some silicone lubricant on the seals and, failing that, might need to change out the seals.

Re. the other parts of the door, the lock itself seems fine. The three strike plates all seem adjusted fine.

 

[Superpossible]

So, I took a look at our garden door which is the exact same brand. The bottom lock side corner is also not aligned with the frame, but there aren't draughts there. Also, the bottom part of the door does not lift unlike our front door.

So, to me that seems to be the issue - why does the bottom part of our door lift? Might it be to do with the locking mechanism (please see pics) ?

 

[crank39]

When you say bottom part of the door lifts then what do you mean, surely the whole door lifts......its one piece?

Turn the cam with an allen key, turn it 90 degrees so the line is pointing inwards, this increases compression as the roller cam slides behind the cup on the frame but make sure the 2 adjustment screws on cup are tight and the cup isn't sliding in and out, only a full turn needed to loosen and tighten these as they're tiny screws with a square nut on the back, don't take screws right out

Turn roller cam for more compression

This cup is already set on maximum compression because the screws are already at the back of the elongated holes, just make sure its tight and not sliding inwards when the cam slides into it, its also worth checking that the cam is actually far enough over to physically go behind the cup hence my suggestion on moving the door sideways with the hinge, should only need to adjust the bottom 2 hinges not all 4

 

[Superpossible]

When you say bottom part of the door lifts then what do you mean, surely the whole door lifts......its one piece?

Turn the cam with an allen key, turn it 90 degrees so the line is pointing inwards, this increases compression as the roller cam slides behind the cup on the frame but make sure the 2 adjustment screws on cup are tight and the cup isn't sliding in and out, only a full turn needed to loosen and tighten these as they're tiny screws with a square nut on the back, don't take screws right out

What I mean is, I am able to place my finger underneath the bottom right corner of the door and pull the door forward a centimetre or so. Also, if I pull/shake the door towards me, it is clear that the bottom of the door moves or shakes slightly. This would suggest that the door is not tight against the frame (and the draughts are coming from that exact area). This doesn't happen with the top of the door which is very tight against the frame.

Will give your suggestions a try,thank you.

When you say 'cup' which part are you referring to?

 

[crank39]

The cup or frame keep is the second picture, the roller cam on the door slide into the cup when you lift the handle, if you can still pull the door away even when the handle is lifted then the cam isn't doing anything, just to confirm though the handle is up and locks engaged when your pulling the door with your fingers?

 

[Superpossible]

Thanks for the pics - really helpful.

Both cams have been turned to face the seal.

I think the problem was that, the bottom frame keep screws were loose (the middle and top ones were fine) . I played around with them to find out which screw positions would work. In doing so, first the door wouldn't lock with the key , then the door handle became stiff when pulling up. After trying different options I have just placed both screws in the middle, and it's fine now in terms of locking and pulling up the handle smoothly.

The bottom part of the door is now much more tight - I cannot pull it as much as previously. It also seems to have reduced much of the draught (yes, this is with the handle up/lock engaged).

I will still adjust the lateral position of the bottom hinges and see if I can move the door towards the right slightly, to see if that might help.

 

[Superpossible]

Have turned the bottom Allen key socket clockwise as much as possible. I would assume that is turned towards the right /lock side now




I've done the same for both lower hinges
The door is now tighter at the bottom, hurrah
There is still a slight draft from that bottom right corner but I'm even more certain it's the seals that are worn out now.
Thanks for all the help @crank39 have learned a lot about uPVC doors these last few days...

 

[crank39]

The cam and the keep adjustment work hand in hand, I find using the keep to take up the main adjustment then turn the cam in small increments to fine adjust, obviously you can now see that by sliding the frame keep right out(which is where it was, maximum compression) and turning the cam so the line is good facing in means everything is on maximum and is too tight to lock which means backing one of them off till you reach the desired point, draught free but still easy to lock

The hinge, yes turning allen bolt just moves the door sideways

 

[Superpossible]

Thanks for the help. A few more questions -

We're still getting drafts in the bottom right corner - I have started to replace the seals on the door frame and door starting with the right hand side & bottom of the door frame. That hasn't yet made a different to the drafts.



Here are pics from the inside and outside of that particular area.

I'm not 100% certain if the draft comes from the door side or the frame side.

If the latter, could it be the sealant? The outside seems pretty worn down and the inside is missing.

Also, the old door seal seemed to be a different type to the one I bought which is a universal Storm guard upvc door seal. Please see pics of the old seal below.



It was attached using adhesive - there doesn't seem to be a way to slot it into the door groove, unlike the replacement seal which can be pushed into the door groove. What type of seal is this?

TIA

 

[crank39]

Because your old seal was co extruded which means it's bonded onto the pvc during the extrusion process, these aren't designed to be pulled off and replaced and in some cases there isn't a slot behind the rubber for a new one to be clipped in, if it's just flat then your only option now is a self adhesive foam seal like you use on wooden door frames

 

[Superpossible]

Ah that is good to know thank you.
There was a slot for me to fit in the new seals. This is the one I bought.

Stormguard uPVC Universal Seal

Replace damaged, worn or tired door and window seals with ease using this uPVC universal seal from Stormguard. It's built to fit most uPVC frames on the market and can be simply pushed into the existing groove on the frame to restore them to weather tightness. That'll then help you to conserve...

www.toolstation.com

I think with the door, an issue is that it is not straight - the lock side of the door slightly drops. I've already adjusted the bottom hinge to increase the height, but it hasn't solved the issue. Is there a solution other than toe and heeling as I would probably need to call someone out for that. Could someone lift up the lock side of the door while I adjust the hinges, if that would make a difference?