Indicators: Who would be to blame?

[AdamW]

I live in a stupid town full of stupid drivers. I nearly had a crash 5 minutes ago on a roundabout because of someone who doesn't believe in that magical stick behind the steering wheel that makes tick-tock noises.

It got me to thinking. Picture a roundabout with four exits evenly spaced around it. Now, Driver A approaches the roundabout from 12 o'clock with the intention of going straight on, but halfway through he changes his mind and decides to turn to his right. He doesn't use his indicators. Driver B approaches from 6 o'clock and wants to go straight on. He sees Driver A is apparently going straight on so enters the roundabout. Driver A then turns right straight into the side of Driver B. Who is to blame?

I have a nasty suspicion that the legal answer would be "Driver B", even though Driver A should have been indicating that he was turning right. Anyone got any anecdotes on this kind of thing?

These idiots who drive round without using indicators could inadvertently be covering their behinds in case they change their mind halfway through a manoeuvre. "EH, I know I wasn't indicating at all, but it was YOU who pulled out in front of ME".

 

[nstreet]

50/50

Driver B,

Indicators should never be relied upon, the junction is a giveway, you should never judge what another car is going to do, indicating or not.

Driver A

Which lane was he in, how are the lanes marked. If he hits someone he is partly to blame for the lack of lane discipline aind correct indication.

 

[WoodYouLike]

I live in a stupid town full of stupid drivers. I nearly had a crash 5 minutes ago on a roundabout because of someone who doesn't believe in that magical stick behind the steering wheel that makes tick-tock noises.

Many times it happens that someone on the roundabout does indicate while I'm about to enter the roundabout. Only problem is...... that driver uses his/her indicator one exit to early!!

 

[Steve]

here is my guide to signalling at a basic 4-way roundabout:

going straight on: no signal until nearing your exit, when you signal left
going left: signal left until clear of roundabout.
going right: signal right until your exit is next. then signal left and move left to outside of roundabout.

roundabouts which are traffic light controlled, and those with a "spiral" arrangement (stay in 1 lane and it takes you straight off at the correct exit) - dont use signals unless changing lanes - it just confuses people.

and to those people who signal right when moving away from the side of the road - WHY??? nobodys going to stop and left you out are they??? just wait for a gap and go! (this is all what i was taught by an ADI aout a year ago)

adam, that other guy would have to accept some blame but unless there were cameras on you or something, it would be your word against his. personally i always wait in situations like that because you never know what people are going to do.

 

[PowerTool]

It's a pet hate of mine - people not indicating
It stems from being a tanker driver for a number of years,and stopping at roundabouts for people who then turn off before you - it's hard work setting off again with 44 tonnes !
Little anecdote - ex-colleague wagon driver coming through Leeds at the end of the M621 some years ago (HUGE roundabout) - 1 car in front,car some distance off,coming round the roundabout (turning right,and indicating correctly,I hasten to add!);thinks "plenty of time to get out,following this car,before that one gets here"...

car in front of him decided to stop....

car written off..

almost undectectable dent in bumper

Moral of the story - don't trust anyone else.

 

[petewood]

don't trust anyone else.

Especially when you are on a motorbike. And even more especially when you are riding along a main road and someone is waiting to pull out from a sidestreet. This is when you become particularly invisible.

 

[andy]

It's a pet hate of mine - people not indicating
It stems from being a tanker driver for a number of years,and stopping at roundabouts for people who then turn off before you - it's hard work setting off again with 44 tonnes !
Little anecdote - ex-colleague wagon driver coming through Leeds at the end of the M621 some years ago (HUGE roundabout) - 1 car in front,car some distance off,coming round the roundabout (turning right,and indicating correctly,I hasten to add!);thinks "plenty of time to get out,following this car,before that one gets here"...

car in front of him decided to stop....

car written off..

almost undectectable dent in bumper

Moral of the story - don't trust anyone else.

worst drivers are the ones what slow down for no reason. i.e coming to a clear roundabout, slowing down to almost nothin when approaching a green light - just incase it changes

 

[Damocles]

Crafty, probably because they would be in danger of failing their test if they followed your ADIs advice?

Interestingly there are other points where an advanced instructor may teach you something which a standard instructor would tell you not to do.

 

[pipme]

Defensive driving, take nothing for granted including sgnals given.
Time and motion ... 5 secs added to journey is nothing, peace of mind and saved resources are everything...

 

[TexMex]

One area that I disagree with accepted practice, is that of indicating to overtake a push bike. Some years back, I had been held up by a push bike on a narrow road. The motorist behind me couldn't see the bike and was just getting frustrated at my tardy progress. When a break in the incoming traffic finally materialised, I indicated right and swerved out to overtake the bike.

The driver behind me, had seen my indication and assumed I was about to turn right. As soon as I shifted to the right hand side of the road, he took the opportunity to overtake down the inside (knocking the poor lad off his bike).

Nowadays, I never indicate to overtake a bike. I simply make a very obvious swerve to overtake them, and then overtake them at a fairly leisurly pace. This should, hopefull, give anyone following an obvious indication that there is an obstruction, and plenty of time to see what it is.

BTW. I belive that, as far as the law is concerned, indicators just indicate intentions. Although their missuse can be cited as a "contributing factor" right of way is what counts.

 

[pipme]

Only one person has 'right of way' on the 'Queens highway' that is her majesty.
I saw this quoted in a report on a motoring court case .. It was apparently used by the Judge himself ...

 

[Damocles]

Which is why she charges us a licence to use it? So how come she does not get the money?

 

[petewood]

Only one person has 'right of way' on the 'Queens highway' that is her majesty.
:

If I wear a headscarf do you think more people will give way to me?

 

[AdamW]

Crafty, probably because they would be in danger of failing their test if they followed your ADIs advice?

Interestingly there are other points where an advanced instructor may teach you something which a standard instructor would tell you not to do.

I've not had advanced classes, but my instructor back in 1997 taught me that if there is no-one else around, pulling away without right indicator is fine.

I use it anyway though, no-one is perfect and there is always a possibility that you didn't notice a car approaching (perhaps it is dark and his lights are off). An indicator will make them aware of your intentions, possibly making the difference between a bit of rubber on the road and a crash.

I guess the whole thing about not trusting indicators is right. To be totally safe and blameless I should have waited for a space that I could fit in even if they did change their mind. It's hard to on a busy road in rush hour though.

Something I have noticed is when I am going to work, people mince about at roundabouts and junctions, not pulling out until there is a massive space. But on the way home I have frantic people driving on my back bumper or pulling out under my nose! I can only guess that when I drive to work I am driving at the same time as people who are just off to the shops but in the evenings I am surrounded by people who want to get home to their tea.

 

[ohmygodwhathaveyoudone]

when i passed my drivig test 23 yrs ago i was always told to indicate so as to show other motorists my intentions.even if no one is about i ALWAYS indicate,don't see the point in looking to see if any other drivers/cyclists/pedestrians are about so just indicate as force of habit.can't go wrong that way.people who do not indicate are just selfish idiots bmw should really giving training courses as how to operate them. btw saw a mountain bike swerve in front of me the other day.
this is a suspension bike with disc brakes that could get up mount everest.
reason why he pulled out.
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a puddle.