is this fair ??

[confused 2]

OK gloves off, get off your b****y high horse you arrogant s**t, are you looking for help & suggestions or not. We know what we are doing!I bet you were a nightmare to work for.

I am sorry that you feel that I am been arrogant, but this reply from you is not in the least helpfull, maybe I am at fault for not getting my point over very well.
To simplify it for "some" simple people, is it your normal practice to quote a price per hour, then without warning add 20%? if so, then I suggest that you do not know what you are doing.

 

[sparkybird]

either that or the client has p*ssed me off something rotten

 

[EddieCurrent]

Hello.

Mabe you should have written
" The electrician doing work for me has put his prices up 20% in the past year, and because of the length of contract( 1yr), and lack of communication(throughout the contract) and written, clear 'price agreements' (before the job started) I feel like I am being ripped off "

May I ask who had the idea of an hourly rate for this contract ?

 

[jj4091]

deleted 8 & 22
Mod Rupert

 

[confused 2]

Hello.

Mabe you should have written
" The electrician doing work for me has put his prices up 20% in the past year, and because of the length of contract( 1yr), and lack of communication(throughout the contract) and written, clear 'price agreements' (before the job started) I feel like I am being ripped off "

May I ask who had the idea of an hourly rate for this contract ?

Thanks for your comments, even though I do not agree with them all, they are rational and constructive, unlike some others.
I think I will just retire gracefully, rather than become involved in an uninvited slanging match

 

[Softus]

confused 2, your opening post contained some inconsistencies that would lead anyone to believe that it's you who doesn't know what you're doing, viz:

12 months ago I asked an electrician [3 man company] for an hourly rate to do the elecrical work on my new build, I agreed the rate he quoted and a few weeks later he came and did the 1st fix.

This means that you asked him on 9th January 2005 (or thereabouts), and that he did the work somewhere in the period starting on that date and ending on, say, 28th Feb 2006, that period being "a few weeks".

The bill was there in 3 days and I was suprised at the larger than expected amount, but as the labour and materiels were not costed separately [just a total] and he seemed to have done a good job I sent a cheque by return post.

This means that you received the bill at the beginning of March 2006, or thereabouts. For you to have been surprised at the amount it also means either that you didn't obtain an estimate for the materials, or that the materials were more than the estimate that you received.

After some delay [12 months] he returned on October 26th to 2nd fix, [2 men and an apprentice] this time, I supplied the materiels.

If he returned on October 26th, then this would have been eight months later, not twelve - this is a significant inconsistency in your story.

The boss and the boy called again on November 8th [on the way back from another job] to connect the tails in the meter box and change the incoming MCB, that the supply company had fitted, to a 100 amp DP unit, they were on site for an hour. this included his electrical test.
Again the bill came in a few days, this time, as it was all labour I knew what rate he had charged me, it was just less than 20% more than he had quoted me, he also charged the same rate for the "boy" the boss had also left the site to go to another job for 2 hours.

1. I don't see a problem with his rate increasing by 20% during the course of eight months. With most of my customers, my own rate increased by 25% over the same period.

2. I don't see a problem with the apprentice being charged at the full rate, if the work he was doing was equivalent in competence and in speed to that of that of his senior.

His invoice for the 2nd fix was dated November 1st but did not arrive until after his visit to fix the tails.

I don't understand the problem with this, since at the time of you writing it you already knew that this bill didn't include the work to connect the tails.

When I saw the rate he had charged me I telephoned him to challenge it, he eventually agreed to reduce his rate by 10%, as I had no wish to fall out with him, I reluctantly agreed to this but stipulated that he must first return to fix some problems, these he did not dispute, and he eventually came personally on January 5th and rectified the problems.

It sounds like you reached a compromise, which does both of you credit.

Today January 9th I received another invoice from him, for connecting the tails, doing the test and issuing a certificate, that eqates to seven hours labour, this figure also includes the issue of the certificate, is this normally charged as a seperate item or should it be included as part of the job.??

This is most bizarre - you refer to something you call "the job", but you didn't seek a price for "the job", merely an hourly rate.

He also says, the certificate will only be issued on payment of the invoice/s

Well, on the one hand he's not entitled to do this, because he should provide you with everything you've asked for and then you should pay the bill. However, he's entitled to expect immediate payment, unless you've agreed terms of credit, and since you've raised at least one objection already then he's just making sure that he gets paid promptly - many of us would be tempted to do the same thing.

I feel he is now taking the p*ss and feel like starting from the beginning and insisting he itemises all invoices, sticks to his original rate,reduces the rate for the "boy" and explains how he has charged me 7 hours for an hours work, I do not think he can charge me travelling time for the fitting of the tails as he only called on his way back from another job [ the same one that he left my site to visit during the 2nd fix] therefore I have already paid his travelling time once.

Since you're unlikely to do business with him again, you now have to ask yourself how much all this hassle is worth to you. The idea of you asking for a bill that you've already paid, and were satisfied with at the time paying, is, quite frankly, ludicrous.

 

[EddieCurrent]

Confused 2.

I don't think it needs to end up as a slanging match either.

I am not saying that I think it is your fault alone that you've ended up in this awkward situation !,
I think the electrician is at fault too, and should have kept you informed of any changes in rates, (and you both should have agreed a price for other workmen) ,before the work took place.

Make him a nice cuppa, and talk it through.( a bacon sarny would work too)

Please don't think that I'm saying that you should let yourself be ripped off if you have been.

Any chance of posting back the outcome when the jobs done, you've got your certs and he has his dosh please ??

 

[scousespark]

This post is quite bizarre.
You had work done nearly a year ago, for which you can't account for the hourly rate but the cost 'seemed' high. You then get the spark back 8 months later, and are surprised his rate had changed. You then compromised with the spark and agreed a new rate. Then you had 3 guys on-site (for an hour) followed by the spark doing the cert, which easily explains your 7 hours.

I don't know what line of business you are in, but it's common for a firm to charge an hourly rate per employee and this doesn't change depending on the experience of the employee. He has the overheads involved in employing staff, and these costs have to be covered by his income.

If he had done a bad job you'd get some sympathy here, but your posts show he has been fair with you. Pay the man and let this go mate, life's too short.

 

[securespark]

Did he quote (ie a fixed price)?

Or did he estimate?

Did he put any of this in writing?

Did you sign an agreement before work started?

I am sorry but once again I will state, please read the original post,
The only quote or statement made was the hourly rate that he stated he would charge me, this is the only real query

I am sorry, too. Once again, I will state, please read my original post.

Did he put it in writing & did you agree to those t's & c's by signing an agreement?

If not, you're stuffed!

 

[jj4091]

OK gloves off, get off your b****y high horse you arrogant s**t, are you looking for help & suggestions or not. We know what we are doing!I bet you were a nightmare to work for.

I am sorry that you feel that I am been arrogant, but this reply from you is not in the least helpfull, maybe I am at fault for not getting my point over very well.
To simplify it for "some" simple people, is it your normal practice to quote a price per hour, then without warning add 20%? if so, then I suggest that you do not know what you are doing.

It was not meant to be in the least helpful, but the first one was: ie. suggest you look at it from the other person's point of view.But I guess there is not much chance of that as you appear blinkered to your own view & will only accept the answer you are looking for, but I do not believe anyone is going to tell you that you have been ripped off. I don't suppose this will be helpful either.