Kitchen - Spur from Fused Socket?

[BeanheadUK]

Hello all,

Been using these forums for a while as a voyeur but first time posting a question.

I have a new-ish build apartment (built 2003) where my kitchen consists of above worktop sockets (x2) and then fused sockets for appliances (hob, extractor, fridge and dishwasher) all leading to a four switch hidden in a kitchen cupboard to manually turn each one off.

However, the above worktop sockets are in the most inconvenient places ever known to man.

I'd like to put another double socket above the worktop in a place that works. Directly below it is the dishwasher fused socket, which tracks back to the four switch mentioned above. The question I have is can I spur from this dishwasher fused socket?

If not, can I somehow get rid of the fused socket (I don't use the dishwasher), extend to above worktop and install a double socket?

It's plasterboard insulated walls so this seems the easiest way but not sure if I can.

Any help appreciated.

Thanks,

Beans

 

[EFLImpudence]

can I somehow get rid of the fused socket (I don't use the dishwasher), extend to above worktop and install a double socket?

You likely mean a fused connector unit; there are no fused sockets.

You could do that but if the cables are all behind plasterboard then you can find the cable to the other sockets and connect extra ones 'properly'.

 

[BeanheadUK]

You likely mean a fused connector unit; there are no fused sockets.

You could do that but if the cables are all behind plasterboard then you can find the cable to the other sockets and connect extra ones 'properly'.

Yes, sorry, FCU.

Do you reckon I'd have to cut a big hole to get sight of the circuit wire? Petrified of cutting massive holes in walls.

Would I use a Junction box to spur off?

Thanks

 

[EFLImpudence]

You have to cut a hole in the plasterboard for the back box in the appropriate location.

If you use a padsaw you may cut a cable behind, so just slowly and carefully cut it with a Stanley knife.
When you have done that you may find the cable to the other sockets.

Otherwise, no, you will not need a junction box just connect the cable with connectors in the existing FCU back box and fit a blank plate instead of the FCU.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

You can spur from the dishwasher socket, but the socket will be controlled by the fuse connection unit that isolates the dishwasher. As FCU will only allow for a 13A load in total, that is what you will be restricted to downstream of the FCU. It would be wiser to extend the circuit from the socket the above worktop sockets, I would take a peep at behind each socket plate, to see if you can establish in which direction the cable run from and to each outlet. When running new cable you must follow the correct methods of routing of the cable.

 

[sparkwright]

Can you not

You can spur from the dishwasher socket, but the socket will be controlled by the fuse connection unit that isolates the dishwasher. As FCU will only allow for a 13A load in total, that is what you will be restricted to downstream of the FCU. It would be wiser to extend the circuit from the socket the above worktop sockets, I would take a peep at behind each socket plate, to see if you can establish in which direction the cable run from and to each outlet. When running new cable you must follow the correct methods of routing of the cable.

As I understood it, the FCU is at the dishwasher (integrated?) and the switch is in a cupboard, so really the FCU needs changing for a blank plate and joint.

The new cable could be connected to the load side of the FCU, but this is unnecessarily fusing it down to 13A.

If the new cable was connected to the feed side of the FCU, this is encouraging a spur on a spur - if someone decides later to connect to the load side for something else.

 

[BeanheadUK]

Thank you all for the advice.

I think even trying anything with the FCU sounds like a real mare.

I think if I'm right it sounds like this is the best option:

1. removing and disconnect the dishwasher,
2. cutting a hole in the wall large enough to get sight of the circuit cables,
3. splicing and using a junction box to do a proper spur,
4. Run cable to hole above worktop,
5. Install new socket above worktop,
6. Refit plasterboard in hole, seal and restore dishwasher to FCU

 

[EFLImpudence]

cutting a hole in the wall large enough to get sight of the circuit cables,

You do not need to cut a hole.
When you remove the FCU and backbox, there will be a hole.

splicing and using a junction box to do a proper spur,

You do not need a junction box.
Connect the existing cable to new cable with any suitable connectors in the replaced back box and fit blank plate.

Run cable to hole above worktop,
Install new socket above worktop,

Yes.

Refit plasterboard in hole,

No need.

seal and restore dishwasher to FCU

Thought you didn't want it.

 

[securespark]

Is this property rented?

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

As I understood it, the FCU is at the dishwasher (integrated?) and the switch is in a cupboard

Well that is an illogical idea if true, surely it would have been more appropriate to have the fuse in an easily accessible location.

 

[BeanheadUK]

You do not need to cut a hole.
When you remove the FCU and backbox, there will be a hole.


You do not need a junction box.
Connect the existing cable to new cable with any suitable connectors in the replaced back box and fit blank plate.


Yes.


No need.


Thought you didn't want it.

Thanks. I don't need the dishwasher... now, but I'm thinking about a new kitchen and may in the future. To me it would just be future proofing.

Is this property rented?

No, owned mate, it's my first property.

Well that is an illogical idea if true, surely it would have been more appropriate to have the fuse in an easily accessible location.

You're telling me. The dishwasher is under worktop end of the length, the switches for the FCU's are the other end in a cupboard above the worktop. Next to it is the boiler switch and another FCU (not labelled).

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

You're telling me. The dishwasher is under worktop end of the length, the switches for the FCU's are the other end in a cupboard above the worktop. Next to it is the boiler switch and another FCU (not labelled).

So please clarify what you have, as I am a little confused.
*You have switches that independently switch under worktop appliances (hob, extractor, fridge and dishwasher)
*These switches are connected to fused connection unit that are located below worktop, behind the appliances, then connected via flex to the appliances?

 

[sparkwright]

So please clarify what you have, as I am a little confused.
*You have switches that independently switch under worktop appliances (hob, extractor, fridge and dishwasher)
*These switches are connected to fused connection unit that are located below worktop, behind the appliances, then connected via flex to the appliances?

That's how I read it.

I can see the logic in that.

It saves frigging around fitting fuse modules at the 4 gang grid switch.

The appliance needs a fuse, the FCU replaces a single socket and plug.

Not sure I'd care for a fuse behind an INTEGRATED appliance, though it's quite normal behind a free-standing appliance.

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

Not sure I'd care for a fuse behind an INTEGRATED appliance, though it's quite normal behind a free-standing appliance.

Nor me, came across one behind an integrated FF, bloody nightmare!

 

[winston1]

The appliance needs a fuse, the FCU replaces a single socket and plug.

No, the fuse is to protect the cable NOT the appliance.