Kitchen wiring tips please!

[JDLDIY]

Just starting to plan the rewire of my kitchen prior ro plasterers and new kitchen, here's what I intend, if anyone could give any advice that would be great.
Under cupboard lighting - I thought this would be best run up from the floor in conduit to run off a fused spur from the power circuit. I'll terminate the conduit behind the wall cabinets. I guess I'll have to put the fusebox behind something that can be moved to get to it.

Power circuits - for on top of units I thought I would run the power off the ring mains and thereby have it rcd protected due to the presence of water etc up there. For fixed units such as fridge/freezer and washer/dryer I thought I might run them off a separate ring or spur from the non-rcd side, fused connection units so that someone can't stick a plug in and mow the lawn without rcd protection.

Oven - I plan to have a double high level oven (electric), would 6mm T+E be what to expect and where in relation to the housing should I run the conduit and connection box?

Extractor and hob - I planned to power these with fcu's off the power circuits with the conduit running from the floor straight up behind the hob.

Can't think of anything else for now but I am particularly interested in advice regarding where I should site the various fcu's/sockets. Is it advisable to cut holes in the fitted units and site the fcu's on the wall behind or run the cables into the cabinets and fix them to the cabinets themselves?

Many thanks for any advice - I'm sure I'll get there in the end!

JD

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Under cupboard lighting - I thought this would be best run up from the floor in conduit to run off a fused spur from the power circuit. I'll terminate the conduit behind the wall cabinets. I guess I'll have to put the fusebox behind something that can be moved to get to it.

Why not down from the lighting circuit? Less distance to chase, and then you can have a 2-gang light switch, one for the ceiling lights, one for the cabinet ones. In any event, try not to hide FCUs - you know where they are, but future owners will curse you and stick pins in little dolls..

Power circuits - for on top of units I thought I would run the power off the ring mains and thereby have it rcd protected due to the presence of water etc up there. For fixed units such as fridge/freezer and washer/dryer I thought I might run them off a separate ring or spur from the non-rcd side, fused connection units so that someone can't stick a plug in and mow the lawn without rcd protection.

Have you thought about using a grid plate with switch and fuse modules instead of normal FCUs?

Oven - I plan to have a double high level oven (electric), would 6mm T+E be what to expect and where in relation to the housing should I run the conduit and connection box?

The connection unit can be where you like - I'd suggest somewhere accessible once the oven is in place, otherwise you'll have lots of slack cable to dress. The control unit has to be within 2m of the device.
6mm² will be fine for any normal domestic oven, but as you are starting from scratch I'd say use 10mm². You may not want an all-electric cooker, but a future occupant might, and they will sacrifice a goat in your honour, and name their children after you.

Extractor and hob - I planned to power these with fcu's off the power circuits with the conduit running from the floor straight up behind the hob.

See comment on grid system. I take it that when you say hob, you mean the igniter for a gas hob, not an electric hob?

Can't think of anything else for now but I am particularly interested in advice regarding where I should site the various fcu's/sockets. Is it advisable to cut holes in the fitted units and site the fcu's on the wall behind or run the cables into the cabinets and fix them to the cabinets themselves?

The whole point of FCUs supplying appliances is to have the fuse more accessible than if it was in the plugtop behind. Much of that advantage is lost if you have to scrabble behind tins of beans to get at the fuse.


Design idea - this may not work, style-wise, in your kitchen, but a very flexible idea for sockets is to use dado/skirting trunking on the wall hard up against the bottom of the wall units. Probably mounted upside down so that the chamered edge is at the bottom.

Makes adding/moving sockets in the future a doddle. But it would depend greatly on the style & colour of the units and walls as to whether they'd look OK. You can also get things like these, but you lose the advantage of not having to bury the wiring:

 

[JDLDIY]

Hi Ban! Thanks for all the input.

Why not down from the lighting circuit? Less distance to chase, and then you can have a 2-gang light switch, one for the ceiling lights, one for the cabinet ones. In any event, try not to hide FCUs - you know where they are, but future owners will curse you and stick pins in little dolls..

LOL! Yeah I agree it would make more sense to keep the under cabinet lights run off the lighting circuits. Problem is that I am already running out of room in my consumer unit with all the lighting crcuits that are going in so it is tempting to run these off the power circuits. I'm easily going to end up with 15 or so GU10 bulbs in the kitchen/diner alone........

As far as the FCU's are concerned, if the units that are going into the kitchen are fitted to the walls and say contain drawers next to built in dishwasher/fridge etc, where would the wiring and FCU/socket normally be located? Directly behind the appliance or behind the unit next to it? I understand that cabinets are normally set back from the wall so probably next to it........

Have you thought about using a grid plate with switch and fuse modules instead of normal FCUs?

Sounds great but I haven't seen one of these, could you supply a pic/link?

The connection unit can be where you like - I'd suggest somewhere accessible once the oven is in place, otherwise you'll have lots of slack cable to dress. The control unit has to be within 2m of the device.
6mm² will be fine for any normal domestic oven, but as you are starting from scratch I'd say use 10mm². You may not want an all-electric cooker, but a future occupant might, and they will sacrifice a goat in your honour, and name their children after you

If the oven is to be situated in a run of tall units with no wall space nearby to fit a control unit to, does it sound OK to run the 10mm cable un the wall behind the unit next to the oven, bring it into the larder unit and terminate on the inside of that? Just wondered if the regs would say that the control unit should be immediately to hand. What do you mean by all electric cooker? I intend it to be a double oven, installed high level.

See comment on grid system. I take it that when you say hob, you mean the igniter for a gas hob, not an electric hob

Yeah a gas hob, just the igniter to worry about.

There's more work in the planning than in the doing I'm bl...y sure of it!

JD

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Hi Ban! Thanks for all the input.

Why not down from the lighting circuit? Less distance to chase, and then you can have a 2-gang light switch, one for the ceiling lights, one for the cabinet ones. In any event, try not to hide FCUs - you know where they are, but future owners will curse you and stick pins in little dolls..

LOL! Yeah I agree it would make more sense to keep the under cabinet lights run off the lighting circuits. Problem is that I am already running out of room in my consumer unit with all the lighting crcuits that are going in so it is tempting to run these off the power circuits. I'm easily going to end up with 15 or so GU10 bulbs in the kitchen/diner alone........

What wattage? 15 x 50W is only just over 3A, and under-cabinet lights tend to be quite low wattage.

Also, a solution to the CU capacity problem, (apart from fitting a bigger one ): come off a 20A breaker with 2.5mm² supplying a bank of switched FCUs next to the CU with 5 or 10A fuses in them from which your lighting circuits run. This saves ways in the CU, and has the added benefit of avoiding the bulb-blows-mcb-trips scenario.

As far as the FCU's are concerned, if the units that are going into the kitchen are fitted to the walls and say contain drawers next to built in dishwasher/fridge etc, where would the wiring and FCU/socket normally be located? Directly behind the appliance or behind the unit next to it? I understand that cabinets are normally set back from the wall so probably next to it........

Strictly speaking there should be a means of isolation in a readily accessible position, and it's arguable that behind the appliance itself, or behind an adjacent cupboard, is not readily accessible. That said, it's often done as you describe. Basically what people don't want are sockets above a worktop with appliances below plugged in, as it's awkward to get the flex past the worktop. The general plan with FCUs is to have them above, with buried cable running straight down to either a flex outlet, or a socket, behind the appliance. If an unfused plug/socket is used (e.g. 15A round-pin) then the only fuse is easily replaced if necessary. People expect plugs, sockets, switches etc in kitchens, and a switched FCU without a neon is no more obtrusive than anything else.

The alternative, as I said, is to have all of the switches and fuses in one place on a grid plate

Have you thought about using a grid plate with switch and fuse modules instead of normal FCUs?

Sounds great but I haven't seen one of these, could you supply a pic/link?

This is the easiest link to provide, but all the major manufacturers have a grid system: http://www.mkelectric.co.uk/PDF/range/Grid Plus.pdf

The connection unit can be where you like - I'd suggest somewhere accessible once the oven is in place, otherwise you'll have lots of slack cable to dress. The control unit has to be within 2m of the device.
6mm² will be fine for any normal domestic oven, but as you are starting from scratch I'd say use 10mm². You may not want an all-electric cooker, but a future occupant might, and they will sacrifice a goat in your honour, and name their children after you

If the oven is to be situated in a run of tall units with no wall space nearby to fit a control unit to, does it sound OK to run the 10mm cable un the wall behind the unit next to the oven, bring it into the larder unit and terminate on the inside of that? Just wondered if the regs would say that the control unit should be immediately to hand. What do you mean by all electric cooker? I intend it to be a double oven, installed high level.

It's a common problem - you just have to do the best you can, and imagine the situation where someone who knew where the switch was, and didn't have to hunt for it, was faced with the need to switch it off PDQ (e.g. it catches fire) - would it make more sense for the switch to be further away, but exposed, or close to hand but behind a door. It's best-judgement time, I'm afraid..

There's more work in the planning than in the doing I'm bl...y sure of it!

'twas ever thus..