LED Lighting in bathroom

[rcpanimal]

I'm very grateful for assistance on this forum.

I am not 100% what you are talking about. My sparky fitted a new 10unit consumer unit and completed full tests. I am not a sparky but he took the socket at the furthest point and a light. He connected something to it and recorded results. He also did some stuff with readings from the consumer unit. The washing machine played up the results slightly and he said that is normal. I've had a certificate from local council saying they have been notified reference consumer unit and part P. As for the other regulations I am not sure what they are or what he will do.

My rewire is for lighting which don't appear to have earths connected to the switches which means I cant put metal plates on. The bathroom previously had downlights which were pretty naff. The halers comply with fire regs and are not covered over in loft.

If something is being done wrong by the sparky please let me know as he appeared highly competent

 

[SimonH2]

What did you do about ensuring compliance with Parts B, C & L of the Building Regulations?

As it happens, those Halers H2 units are quite handy in that respect. Sealed and fire rated means B & C are pretty well automatically covered unless you fit them really badly. Part L should be a given if you are replacing anything incandescent with LED.

If something is being done wrong by the sparky please let me know as he appeared highly competent

Some sparks don't have too much idea when it comes to fitting these lights - that was the case with the one my mate employed. "Fire rated" does not mean you can ignore the manufacturers instructions about leaving a clear space round the fitting for cooling. Adding some boxes to keep the insulation off is on the "to do" list.

 

[PCAnimal]

what sort of boxes?

 

[SimonH2]

http://www.fastlec.co.uk/click-gb400-insulation-support-box-freestanding-flat-packed-p-2253.html
This sit on the boarding, there are others that are supported on the joists.

Also, in another thread here, this was posted
http://www.aico.co.uk/downlights-in-loft-space-what-to-fit.html

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Sealed and fire rated means B & C are pretty well automatically covered unless you fit them really badly.

Fire rated means that they'll have an intumescent component which swells up and closes off all the holes when there's a fire. It does not mean that when there isn't a fire there's no path for warm moist air to get into the loft.

Part L should be a given if you are replacing anything incandescent with LED.

L1(b), yes. But not L1(a) if you've made a gap in the insulation.

 

[SimonH2]

Sealed and ...

Fire rated means that they'll have an intumescent component which swells up and closes off all the holes when there's a fire. It does not mean that when there isn't a fire there's no path for warm moist air to get into the loft.

You missed the "sealed" bit. There's a test report on the sealing effectiveness on their site.

 

[gadget300]

Just finished a bathroom and used LED for the first time. Went with JCC LED7 d/lighters. 7watts usage, very very bright only used 2 in the room. Push fit connections and rachet cable clamp for quicker installations and the best bit 10 year warranty in a domestic situation. The fixed base ones are IP65 and fire rated as standard, certainly will be using them again.

 

[gregd72002]

Hi,

I'm considering exactly the same thing. Was thinking of getting halogen lights but after reading some threads I think I will go with LED lights. Though, this somehow is pushing me back:

http://www.electronicsweekly.com/blogs/led-lights/2009/01/why-can-led-not-yet-rival-halogen.html

Does Halers H2 really need so much space behind (on the attic)??? This seems to be a major problem for me...

 

[SimonH2]

That article is several years old, LEDs have come along a bit since.

The fitting instrcutions for the Halers H2 is here. You'll see that they specify 50mm above the fitting, and 75mm around it.
The Spec Sheet gives it's dimensions as 90mm dia x 84mm height (the height above the ceiling will be less).

In practical terms, it's probably not that critical, especially if the enclosure is metallic (ie heat conductive).
So, if you are constrained on height, but can allow more width, and use one of those steel boxes to keep the insulation off, then the steel box will carry the heat away and dissipate it over a wider area.

And of course, there's a big difference between a halogen using 50W and an LED using 7W - 50W will get you a lot more temperature for a given space/enclosure. With the much lower output from a 7W fitting, it's more likely that your issue is the temperature of the LED and electronics rather than setting fire to the property.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

So, if you are constrained on height, but can allow more width, and use one of those steel boxes to keep the insulation off, then the steel box will carry the heat away and dissipate it over a wider area.

How will it do that when it will be covered with a thick layer of insulation, which is there in order to prevent heat loss?

 

[SimonH2]

That's a good question, but the MIs allow for these things to be installed under a complete cover of insulation as long as there's a certain amount of space around them.
Even the best insulation will leak heat, and of course the light fitting is installed into a ceiling which will itself conduct heat - especially if you allow a minimum area to be exposed to the warm air.

As an aside, you'll probably not be surprised to know that I fairly regularly have to explain to people that ... no, that small closed cupboard isn't a good place to move your server to - it's only cool now because you don't have a several hundred watt fan heater going continuously in it

 

[gregd72002]

Right, I think I will simply go for the bigger version of these:
http://www.aico.co.uk/downlights-in-loft-space-what-to-fit.html

They seem to provide enough venting space for Halers H2 so I do not have to be worried that insulation is laying on top of it...