My 27Kw Real Time Energy Usage...

[eveares]

I would find one useful for energy saving.

Or back in the days of incandescent lighting where one would leave all the lights on, and not realise actually how power was being drawn.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I would find one useful for energy saving.

I would use it to alert me to the times when electricity usage increases, thus making me aware of the frequency of use of heavier appliances.

Are there people in your house who run appliances when they are not needed?

Or back in the days of incandescent lighting where one would leave all the lights on, and not realise actually how power was being drawn.

One might not have known how much power was being used, but why would one need to know how much in order to need to know to turn lights off if they weren't needed?

 

[eveares]

One might not have known how much power was being used, but why would one need to know how much in order to need to know to turn lights off if they weren't needed?

That is true, I have to say. I think for a lot of people power meters are just one of them gadgets advertised around the place and people thus go and buy one.

If you need to use power, you do; and if you don't then you Don't.

 

[ericmark]

I can see how monitoring power used can help. But not total power used. And even using one of the plug in energy monitors it is rather limited. Out of interest I did take a plug in type and tried it with different appliance.

The washing machine is however a good example. Using the same program selected every time the readings varied to quite a large extent. The problem was the washing machine weighs the load, so power used varies not only with program selected but also the cloths put in the washer.

This variation is repeated many times, even a simple TV will vary in power used with volume set.

I do use one. What the energy meter does which a simple clamp on meter can't do is measure power used over a set time. Also maximum and minimum power used. So for example before double glazing one could measure the power used to heat a room with thermostatic control with a north wind of 10 MPH and outside ambient temperature of 5°C, then after double glazing do same experiment. However if the wind changes or the ambient temperature changes then it does not work.

Putting the Sky+ HD box on the energy meter both on stand-by and running I realised there was very little difference so today never bother with stand-by. In other words the reverse to what one is lead to believe is best option.

There are a number of items on the list you give which will not run either flat out or full time. The 1/2 horse motor will take 375W fully loaded, but light load likely a lot less. But unless knowing the result will alter how you do things it is a little point less.

 

[securespark]

Are there people in your house who run appliances when they are not needed?

No. Why should that be relevant?

If in my house I had a meter that, for example went amber or red when heavy loads were switched on, it would make me realise what we are using and when and could lead to modifying our behaviour to save electricity.

I'm not saying appliances are run when they are not needed, but there may be more efficient ways of using them.

 

[ericmark]

I am sure waiting until there is enough washing to fill the washing machine, or enough dishes to fill the dish washer will be a more efficient use of both labour and power. However that means more cloths, and more dishes which in turn means a bigger house to hold them.

I am sure there is an opium number of shoes which means feet are not stressed by the regular change of foot wear. But to find out would need a study and even if you found the opium number that does not mean the women in the house would agree to the limit!

It really does not matter, is shoes or phones with their array of chargers the number used is it seem not controlled by common sense. Even a easy thing like unplugging the lap top charger, I will admit I never unplug it. We all know it makes sense but today even having a master switch on the ring would not work as so many chargers in the house.

My father-in-law was 90 last week and he is old school, he switches off everything at night, no one ever phones him when he is in bed, the cordless phones simply don't work with no power. Maybe that's the correct method?

But it does not require an energy meter to show us some thing electric uses power. The standard annual energy consumption (SAEc) with labels when we buy is a good idea, but once bought it is rather too late to be finding out the power it uses.

It would be good to know, if cooking the veg, which uses the least power, the simple microwave, the microwave with a pressure cooker inside, the simple hob, we will assume induction, or the hob with a pressure cooker, or the stand alone pressure cooker, and even using that, with pressure or as simple pan? But the problem is my cooker is hard wired so even if I wanted to measuring power used is hard. I would guess the stand alone pressure cooker as it is better insulated than the rest, why don't we have tea cosy for pans? (assuming induction again)

The freezer is a good example of the general con where we are miss lead. Plan a kitchen and you don't consider that these energy labels are not on a level playing field. We assume if we get a A+ rated built in USA style fridge/freezer rather than a chest freezer and stand alone fridge also A+ rated together having the same capacity that they will use some where about the same power. Wrong, there are special allowances, if built in it can use more power, if designed to work in a hotter climate it can used more power, if frost free it can use more power, if upright it can use more power, yes the kWh/annum is still good, but the A+ label is akin to a chocolate fire guard.

As to freezer size compared with fuel used in the car that is also a problem, weekly, twice weekly or monthly shop will result is more or less car fuel, but all it requires is to run out of bread and all those calculations go up the creak. As to all the children arriving together with all the grand children on tow because some has told them it's father day, that knocks out all the calculations as to how much milk is required up the creak.

I am sure some one very clever using the data could design an energy efficient household, but with all this save the planet stuff, now instead of one bin wagon a week we have two or three, one collects garden waste, another collects general waste, a further one collects recyclable waste, and yet another to collect items which will not fit in the bin, as without the bin standard wagon does not allow the workers to put anything into it. Just can't see how three wagons use less fuel than one? Plus more space required to store rubbish as they call less often.

As to ornamental gardens clearly these are a waste, we all should live under ground, with solar panels on poles and crops grown under them. What a boring world. Next will be thought police, or have we passed 1984?

 

[ban-all-sheds]

As to freezer size compared with fuel used in the car that is also a problem, weekly, twice weekly or monthly shop will result is more or less car fuel, but all it requires is to run out of bread and all those calculations go up the creak. As to all the children arriving together with all the grand children on tow because some has told them it's father day, that knocks out all the calculations as to how much milk is required up the creak.

Bread and milk can both be stored in the freezer.

But you do need some advance notice to be able to use the latter.

 

[ericmark]

As to freezer size compared with fuel used in the car that is also a problem, weekly, twice weekly or monthly shop will result is more or less car fuel, but all it requires is to run out of bread and all those calculations go up the creak. As to all the children arriving together with all the grand children on tow because some has told them it's father day, that knocks out all the calculations as to how much milk is required up the creak.

Bread and milk can both be stored in the freezer.

But you do need some advance notice to be able to use the latter.

It seems not blue top full fat, the red top yes you can freeze. It is down to fat content the fat will not freeze at -18°C. Bread yes it will freeze but it is rather bulky and to use up freezer space to freeze bread is not very good use of it.

Vesta ready meals don't need the freezer, and the same applies to tins. As to money saved on fuel v money spent freezing it plus of course the extra space required well not so sure. Using 5 draws week one, week two and a very good system to ensure rotation clearly money spent on fuel exceeds that spent keeping freezer cold. But it seems we have a rota worked out, wife buys the food and stocks freezer, then daughter puts food in bin as past eat by date. Theory my work, but in practice it's a failure.

But then we get to type of freezer too. When I wanted a freezer big enough to take the Christmas turkey what was required was ability to remove draws, this in turn means frost free, this in turn means quite a large freezer.

So it really does not matter what theory says as to size of freezer and how much it uses. It's down to government with their regulations which has resulted in fridge/freezers having very much bigger fridge compartments to freezer compartments so it seems whole family has a fridge/freezer plus a freezer, if the freezer compartment was larger than the fridge then it would save loads on money.

So again what is the point of an energy meter, even when you find what you need, you simply can't buy it.

 

[winston1]

But it seems we have a rota worked out, wife buys the food and stocks freezer, then daughter puts food in bin as past eat by date.

Surely the eat by date only applies to food you buy and don't freeze. Once you freeze the 'clock' stops.

 

[JohnD]

correct. Once frozen, you have a "best before" period, as the food will gradually lose its eating quality (for example, fruit and meat dry out, but casseroles last a very long time) but is still safe. Factory packaged frozen food is scientifically prepared and packed to maximise its storage period.

Personally I don't bother freezing milk any more. Longlife skimmed keeps well in the cupboard, and is good enough for custard, rice pudding, porage or hot drinks, and is ready at the twist of a cap. I also support my local dairy farm, who deliver, so even in case of illness, I can get extra next day without anyone needing to go to the shops.

If you were sick, disabled or housebound you could place an order over the 'net for home delivery, and I found with my disabled mother they were happy to carry it into the kitchen for her.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

It seems not blue top full fat, the red top yes you can freeze.

We have semi-skimmed - freezes fine.

It is down to fat content the fat will not freeze at -18°C.

Cheese freezes. Texture not always as it should be when defrosted though.

Bread yes it will freeze but it is rather bulky and to use up freezer space to freeze bread is not very good use of it.

Depends on whether you have the space (eg large chest freezer in the garage). The idea is to only have 1 loaf in there as an "emergency spare".

Ditto a pint of milk, which will defrost overnight.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Longlife skimmed keeps well in the cupboard, and is good enough for custard, rice pudding, porage or hot drinks, and is ready at the twist of a cap.

Vile stuff.

It's like the Devil's billy.

 

[JohnD]

Adequate for a rice pudding or making custard, when it will be heated anyway.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Rice pudding is the Devil's billy with lumps in.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Rice pudding is the Devil's billy with lumps in.

Try jam; much better than lumps.