naseem in jail was it the correct verdict

[Winstonchurchill]

I'm not taking sides here and also find it boring but Paul Brown did accuse Ellal of lying and exagerating his posts.

I have read the whole thread several times and have also seen the reconstruction on TV .

It is very easy to see why PB says ellal was lying and exagerating his posts.

Richardp,Bas and noodlz. Are you on a bullying mission? You should all have the b***s to be more upfront and truthful.

You are all carrying grudges because he disagree's with your left wing idealism.

.

 

[Softus]

If you are committing an offence when you write off your £320k car, does the insurance still pay out ?

Of course it does - why would it not?

I mean would it pay out for the damage to your own car, or does it only pay out for your out-of-pocket stuff if you've been acting lawfully ?

You seem to be distinguishing between liabilities in a strange way.

Firstly, there is a legal requirement to be insured such that a third party can be compensated in the event of an accident - this applies both to car damage and personal injury.

Secondly, whether or not the policy holder's own car is covered by the policy is a matter of contract. Whether or not the contract is voided by dangerous driving is also a matter of contract, but I doubt that it would be (voided).

It strikes me that many posters are allowing their natural feelings of indignance to colour their judgement about what is just and fair. It annoys me greatly that Naseem can afford a big fast car and then can't control it, or himself, but the fact that he's allowed to do what he did is as much a fault of driver education as being down to his own shortcomings. If big fast cars were licensed in the same way as big fast motorcycles, with the attendent training involved, then there's a greater than zero likelihood that he would have had a more responsible attitude when driving it.

His wealth has nothing to do with his actions - the victim could just have easily been maimed by Naseem in a clapped-out Vauxhall Viva. The law demands a custodial sentence, but there may be an argument for an additional, means-tested, fine.

 

[ellal]

I'm not taking sides here and also find it boring but Paul Brown did accuse Ellal of lying and exagerating his posts.

I have read the whole thread several times and have also seen the reconstruction on TV .

It is very easy to see why PB says ellal was lying and exagerating his posts.

Richardp,Bas and noodlz. Are you on a bullying mission? You should all have the b***s to be more upfront and truthful.

You are all carrying grudges because he disagree's with your left wing idealism.

Ellal you need a bar of soap in your mouth, you are as common as muck.

well I think we could search for hours and never find a post so inaccurate and full of cr*p as that....

have you been taking lessons from a certain PB about how to make a conclusion fit your warped opinions of others?..

Or maybe you just forgot to wake up your brain before posting!!

Funny about how you accuse people of things, stick in a vitriolic post yourself - and then claim..

I'm not taking sides here and also find it boring....You are all carrying grudges because he disagree's with your left wing idealism.

Nice one!.......

 

[ellal]

His wealth has nothing to do with his actions - the victim could just have easily been maimed by Naseem in a clapped-out Vauxhall Viva. The law demands a custodial sentence, but there may be an argument for an additional, means-tested, fine.

nice summation..

 

[masona]

His wealth has nothing to do with his actions - the victim could just have easily been maimed by Naseem in a clapped-out Vauxhall Viva.

Don't know about that one, would Naseem showed off in a clapped-out Vauxhall Viva

 

[jbonding]

His wealth has nothing to do with his actions - the victim could just have easily been maimed by Naseem in a clapped-out Vauxhall Viva.

Don't know about that one, would Naseem showed off in a clapped-out Vauxhall Viva

you could in Scotland

 

[Winstonchurchill]

Ellal wrote.

well I think we could search for hours and never find a post so inaccurate and full of cr*p as that....

have you been taking lessons from a certain PB about how to make a conclusion fit your warped opinions of others?..

Or maybe you just forgot to wake up your brain before posting!!

Funny about how you accuse people of things, stick in a vitriolic post yourself - and then claim..

Quote:
I'm not taking sides here and also find it boring....You are all carrying grudges because he disagree's with your left wing idealism.



Nice one!.......

Your comment doesn't in the least bit surprise me in that it contains filthy language. Still I can't help you lacking class.

At least you haven't denied telling lies, but then that would be difficult for you now.

I will start with sloggers post(the relevant part of it that is)
Slogger wrote.

i am sure he didnt mean for the rich to not be jailed for stupidity


stupidity goes across the board it is one thing that makes us human


there are better ways to punish people than taking there libertys

You replied.

seems clear to me..the quote was - 'I also don't see the point in jailing very wealthy people for what is essentially stupidity'

This is actually what PB wrote and anyone can go back and read it too.

Although I don't condone it, I also don't see the point in jailing very wealthy people for what is essentially stupidity, rather than an intended crime. It was a dangerous driving, it went wrong and the other guy paid for it with his injuries.

As regards the sentence, I would prefer too see him fined his best nine months earnings instead and share the money between the NHS and the victim.

This sentence will have no deterrant value at all, its just filling cells, which are needed for real criminals.

If we were all truthful, I have a feeling we would all like to see what one of these cars would do.

Tell me Ellal, did the copy and paste go wrong or were you deliberately devious and sly in your attemp to deceive?

Later on you make further justification for your lies by saying PB was speaking plural. You said he wanted a two tier legal system. He denied this saying he was only speaking about Naseem.

I can only agree with PB because he is clearly speaking in singular as he says this in the part you deliberately omitted.

I would prefer too see him fined

I have no vested interest in PB or anyone else and only want to see fair play. If you are going to litter the forum with lies and abuse you can expect to be pulled up for it.

 

[Softus]

Back off guys, and remind yourselves of the big picture.

What's the best way of arriving at a fair and just system of punishment, given that huge disparity in wealth between different criminals?

Should money ever be traded for a custodial sentence? Should those are wealthy pay extra, when the wealth didn't result from the crime?

Should celebrities be expected to set a better example?

Should fast cars be harder to obtain, and/or should there be compulsory advanced training before they can be used? Perhaps even a different license class? Should Naseem (and those guilty of similar crimes) be allowed to drive a sports car again? Ever? Or any car? Ever?

 

[toffee]

there isnt any continuity with 'penalties' doled out from courts, even amongst us commoners.
You dont need to go into the realms of celebrities to see that 'punishment' never reflects the crime.

 

[plastered]

Should Naseem (and those guilty of similar crimes) be allowed to drive a sports car again? Ever? Or any car? Ever?

No..No...No...No!

 

[Winstonchurchill]

Softus, I am not sure if your reply was aimed at me or not.

I apologise if i'm off thread, but my thoughts are nothing to do with the thread itself.

I am more concerned about the general abuse of and bad language directed towards fellow members.

I do not doubt that PB can be tiresome at times. That said, there is still no justification for what can only be termed revenge. Ellal, then to a lesser degree, others, have deliberately fostered ill will. They have behaved wth the instincts of a pack, not because of the topic or PB's opinion, but solely because it was him.

Clearly though, they have picked the wrong thread because unusually PB did not retaliate and was very placid and polite.

I make no apologies for showing lies and deceipt where it clearly exists and suggest anyone with doubt reads the full thread, it is littered with anomolies.

 

[Softus]

Softus, I am not sure if your reply was aimed at me or not.

Not particularly - no offence meant.

I apologise if i'm off thread, but my thoughts are nothing to do with the thread itself.

I am more concerned about the general abuse of and bad language directed towards fellow members.

I do not doubt that PB can be tiresome at times. That said, there is still no justification for what can only be termed revenge. Ellal, then to a lesser degree, others, have deliberately fostered ill will. They have behaved wth the instincts of a pack, not because of the topic or PB's opinion, but solely because it was him.

Clearly though, they have picked the wrong thread because unusually PB did not retaliate and was very placid and polite.

I make no apologies for showing lies and deceipt where it clearly exists and suggest anyone with doubt reads the full thread, it is littered with anomolies.

[/quote]
I agree, and especially with the last bit. pb and I have our differences, but I think we've moved beyond them now.

However, nothing can be done now about the lies and deceipt - and believe me I've had my share of fights with liars, but very rarely do they get resolved, which is why I suggested that "they ain't wurf it".

 

[ellal]

Since you want to persist in this...

Ellal wrote.
Your comment doesn't in the least bit surprise me in that it contains filthy language. Still I can't help you lacking class.

Filthy language?..lacking class?

At least you haven't denied telling lies, but then that would be difficult for you now.

Where have you pointed out a lie?..you are obviously a fellow student of 'pedantic semantics' (where there is a sith, there is a master - which are you?..), and you have quoted nothing that suggests a lie - merely playing with quotes/words to try and justify an argument that has run out of steam ( even if there was any there in the first place..)..!

If you are going to litter the forum with lies and abuse you can expect to be pulled up for it.

Funny, I was just wondering the same about you (and PB of course)!

I'm sure everyone's bored with this, but if you want to continue making a fool of yourself, be my guest..

edit:..

Ellal, then to a lesser degree, others, have deliberately fostered ill will. They have behaved wth the instincts of a pack, not because of the topic or PB's opinion, but solely because it was him.

If you think that, then you are sorely misguided..

I take each issue on it's merits, will put my view forward, and don't make a point of 'going for someone' irrespective of whether they are of the same opinion or not - that appears to be your warped vision of this!

In this case, the first antagonistic post (you of course will disagree) was PB's (and yes I have re-read..)..the rest, as they say is history!

 

[Softus]

...they ain't wurf it...

rant rant bicker bicker rant

Clearly I was mistaken

 

[JulieL/B]

I agree, and especially with the last bit. pb and I have our differences, but I think we've moved beyond them now.

However, nothing can be done now about the lies and deceipt - and believe me I've had my share of fights with liars, but very rarely do they get resolved, which is why I suggested that "they ain't wurf it".

I agree!!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Winston.............One of the essential requirements necessary to post on here is a 'broad back'!!

paulbrown - and you should know this by now