New Boiler Advice

[lmc1321]

Hi there,

We've been having issues with our boiler for a couple of months now. It keeps needing to be reset, so most days it won't come on until we press the reset button. More recently we're having to reset it or turn it off and on completely 3-4 times before it comes on.

The boiler is 14 years old (it's a Potterton Suprima 40L) so it's possible it'll need replacing, but not sure. I've read that it could be a faulty circuit board: //www.diynot.com/diy/threads/potterton-suprima-40l-lockout-likely-causes.76759

We also have a Santon Premier Plus PP150B water cylinder (unvented) -- not sure if we have anything in the loft, haven't actually checked since moving in.

So I suppose my question is, should we replace the boiler with it being so old, and if so, what type should we get.

We live in a 3-storey semi-detached house with 3 bedrooms. Main bathroom on first floor with a bath/shower, and an en-suite with shower on the top floor. See attached pic for an idea of the size.

A plumber has recommended an Ideal Logic+ 35kw combi boiler, or an Ideal Logic+ Heat 24 Heat Only boiler if we don't want a combi.

I've tried to do as much research as possible about the pros and cons of comb-boilers, but I still can't decide what'd be best. I've had a combi before, and not being able to use two taps at the same time was a bit of a pain, but hot water on demand was good. If the combi mentioned about would be able to push out enough water then I'd probably go with that, but if not then I'd rather keep the cylinder.

That's another thing, is our cylinder actually worth keeping - buying one new is like £700 I think? Would it make more sense to use it and get a conventional boiler?

Also wondered about System boilers -- not clear on how we have a conventional boiler with an unvented cylinder.

Any help/advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

 

[TCCHeating]

Definately keep the unvented cylinder. You currently have a much better system than a combi system.

With regards to if you should replace your current boiler or get it repaired?

That's completely up to you. Get a few quotes for repair and a few more quotes for replacing it and weigh up the price of repair vs the price and benefits of a new boiler.

At 14 years old it might be worth going with a replacement boiler. But who is to say that if you get it repaired you might get another 10 years out of the current boiler

 

[gmgas]

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

 

[lmc1321]

Definately keep the unvented cylinder. You currently have a much better system than a combi system.

With regards to if you should replace your current boiler or get it repaired?

That's completely up to you. Get a few quotes for repair and a few more quotes for replacing it and weigh up the price of repair vs the price and benefits of a new boiler.

At 14 years old it might be worth going with a replacement boiler. But who is to say that if you get it repaired you might get another 10 years out of the current boiler

Thanks, I was leaning towards keeping the cylinder but that makes me more confident it'd be the better choice.

I don't suppose you'd know whether we need/have a 'system' boiler or a conventional boiler? The Ideal Logic+ System boiler for example says it's for pressurised systems, which is what I assumed we had due to the unvented cylinder, but the plumber recommended the conventional Ideal Logic+ Heat; not sure if they're both compatible?

 

[DP]

Definately keep the unvented cylinder. You currently have a much better system than a combi system.

With regards to if you should replace your current boiler or get it repaired?

That's completely up to you. Get a few quotes for repair and a few more quotes for replacing it and weigh up the price of repair vs the price and benefits of a new boiler.

At 14 years old it might be worth going with a replacement boiler. But who is to say that if you get it repaired you might get another 10 years out of the current boiler

Setup is simple and hard to beat.
Boiler is easily repairable. You want to find someone who is a repairer first and will replace the appliance if really necessary instead of looking at the age of appliance andrightaway suggest replacement now that is going to be a difficult find

Looking at replacing a boiler that is about 5 years old- too much wrong with it. Replaced a four year old that constantly broke down, yet have boilers 25 or 30 years still providing good service

Easily repairable. Not much to go wrong on your suprima

 

[DP]

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

 

[shambolic]

The heat only

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

Eh? Heat only doesn't have any parts brass or plastic. It only consists of your so called leaky heat exchanger.
Look no bits!!!

 

[gmgas]

The heat only

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

Eh? Heat only doesn't have any parts brass or plastic. It only consists of your so called leaky heat exchanger.
Look no bits!!!
View attachment 96811

The sump is plastic and they leak

 

[gmgas]

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

Yeah right I'd sooner have a plastic part over brass not in my house don't believe ideal they would say that plastic is good cos it's cheap an they use it

 

[lmc1321]

Thanks for the replies.

So the one thing I'm still not clear on is whether I currently have a 'System' set up, or a conventional set up, and whether or not both options are open to me for use with my existing cylinder.

If a conventional boiler can be used with an unvented cylinder, what's the difference between that and a 'System' boiler/setup?

 

[DP]

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

Yeah right I'd sooner have a plastic part over brass not in my house don't believe ideal they would say that plastic is good cos it's cheap an they use it

What about all those pump bodies that are plastic.
Sometimes folk have polarised views based on what others say. Ideal is a big player that sells stack load of boilers. A small percentage of fails easily becomes a large number. Consider million boiler sales with failure rate of 2% - that is a large number of fails against 10% fails with appliance sales so say 1000 units

 

[Madrab]

Your current boiler can be either a sealed pressurised system or an open vented system. You boiler is a heat only system, which means it heats the hot water indirectly through the un-vented hot water cylinder.

System boilers are usually pressurised systems. Not normally used where an older low pressure open vented CH/HW setup currently exists due to the current pipework not being able to cope with the higher pressure unless the circuits are fully tested as sound. Being sealed also removes the need for at least 1 tank in the attic.

A conventional boiler would usually be used when working with an older open vented CH/HW circuit that is low pressure and fed from tanks in the attic.

You would need your system checked to see if it's open vented or sealed and take it from there. Check if there are 2 active tanks in the loft or if you have an expansion vessel (usually red) with pressure gauge situated anywhere (not the one that may be connected to the un-vented cylinder - usually white/blue)

 

[shambolic]

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

Yeah right I'd sooner have a plastic part over brass not in my house don't believe ideal they would say that plastic is good cos it's cheap an they use it

Let's see how long the brass lasts with condensate and acidic flue gases going through ya numpty.

 

[shambolic]

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

Yeah right I'd sooner have a plastic part over brass not in my house don't believe ideal they would say that plastic is good cos it's cheap an they use it

What about all those pump bodies that are plastic.
Sometimes folk have polarised views based on what others say. Ideal is a big player that sells stack load of boilers. A small percentage of fails easily becomes a large number. Consider million boiler sales with failure rate of 2% - that is a large number of fails against 10% fails with appliance sales so say 1000 units

This is one of the things I've been saying for a while. We are a victim of our own succes 1.2million boilers with 50,000 failures is nothing.
5000 sales with 500 failures you never hear about as not many people fit them.
Ps these figures are just made up for comparison type thing.

 

[gmgas]

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

Yeah right I'd sooner have a plastic part over brass not in my house don't believe ideal they would say that plastic is good cos it's cheap an they use it

Let's see how long the brass lasts with condensate and acidic flue gases going through ya numpty.

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

Yeah right I'd sooner have a plastic part over brass not in my house don't believe ideal they would say that plastic is good cos it's cheap an they use it

What about all those pump bodies that are plastic.
Sometimes folk have polarised views based on what others say. Ideal is a big player that sells stack load of boilers. A small percentage of fails easily becomes a large number. Consider million boiler sales with failure rate of 2% - that is a large number of fails against 10% fails with appliance sales so say 1000 units

This is one of the things I've been saying for a while. We are a victim of our own succes 1.2million boilers with 50,000 failures is nothing.
5000 sales with 500 failures you never hear about as not many people fit them.
Ps these figures are just made up for comparison type thing.

Ideal logic have had leaking main heat exchangers and have plastic parts in them now the earlier version was brass

High tec plastics not much different from brass counterparts. It is the O rings that eventually cause the leaks What is the point of fitting a brass component if it will be replaced instead of repairig it. Obviously brass is easily refurbished whereas plastic can get hairline cracks.

Was at ideal course in Reading to be told failure of plastic parts nearly the same as brass

Yeah right I'd sooner have a plastic part over brass not in my house don't believe ideal they would say that plastic is good cos it's cheap an they use it

Let's see how long the brass lasts with condensate and acidic flue gases going through ya numpty.

You the one who said no plastic
In it I know the sump has to be plastic but can they be non leaking an non splitting plastic look on cc recent post
Ideal logic here we go again

Do You work for ideal shambolic which is cool if so but hardly unbiased
I would say there boilers are Cool if they paid me wages
You accept these fails but what causes them in your opinion
I am interested not wanting to upset you is it a flaw in manufacture or design prob
I know you may not be able to say on here if you work for them