Lets not forget most decent installers will honour a warranty which also costs time and money plus will have put a day in quoting, planning, sourcing and obtaining. So what if a plumber / heating engineer clears a grand a week?, that is not even enough to give him a mortgage for an average priced house. There are people in this country who earn million pound bonuses by investing your money....this country is a total joke we make nothing and provide nothing of any value any more...the rate it's going we will be a 3rd world nation in our own generation.
New boiler - do these costs sound right ?
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Speaking from a neutral perspective - I think the rise in house prices has contributed to some tradesmen overpricing.
They think, well if this house "was bought/is worth" 200k then 3.5k is peanuts. But actually its not peanuts is it.
With inflation only at 2%, the 3.5k wont deflate away like it used to before. And the 200k mortgage will be worth around 120k in real terms in 20 years time (around 3/5ths) - hardly the same as people who bought 20 years ago for 20k? Now looking at a mortgage of 1/10th of the value of their house.
You see the problem. Its all going tits up.
And we havent even touched gas/electricity prices....
They think, well if this house "was bought/is worth" 200k then 3.5k is peanuts. But actually its not peanuts is it.
With inflation only at 2%, the 3.5k wont deflate away like it used to before. And the 200k mortgage will be worth around 120k in real terms in 20 years time (around 3/5ths) - hardly the same as people who bought 20 years ago for 20k? Now looking at a mortgage of 1/10th of the value of their house.
You see the problem. Its all going tits up.
And we havent even touched gas/electricity prices....
I ahve no opinion one or tother in this thread but it has reminded me of something soemone once told me (think it was a potterton trainer tyoe bloke)
In 1970 a mini would cost about 500 (I could be wrong so please dont pull me up on what a mini actually cost) and a central heating system cost about 1500
nowadays a mini costs about 10k and a heating system still is about 2k
makes you think dont it,
(sits back and awaits the flurry of posts abot how much a mini and a central heating system really cost in 1970)
In 1970 a mini would cost about 500 (I could be wrong so please dont pull me up on what a mini actually cost) and a central heating system cost about 1500
nowadays a mini costs about 10k and a heating system still is about 2k
makes you think dont it,
(sits back and awaits the flurry of posts abot how much a mini and a central heating system really cost in 1970)
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corgiman said:I ahve no opinion one or tother in this thread but it has reminded me of something soemone once told me (think it was a potterton trainer tyoe bloke)
In 1970 a mini would cost about 500 (I could be wrong so please dont pull me up on what a mini actually cost) and a central heating system cost about 1500
nowadays a mini costs about 10k and a heating system still is about 2k
makes you think dont it,
(sits back and awaits the flurry of posts abot how much a mini and a central heating system really cost in 1970)
Good post. Whether you can compare like with like is another matter.
They'd probably been making cars for years, wherease CH was a new thing technologically?
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goalc said:
its a pity you live down south the northern lads are banging this system in for around £1750 if you bought the combi pack which is sent to your doorstep of the net and , get these 10 a penny gas installers working on £12.00 hr/ you get it fitted for £1.100 dont be put off agul with these chaps as i will promise you there are plenty sat at home with no work at all.
remember pal your the boss
Right, my turn
Hot water and heating is my number one luxury item on top of my lists and yet people quite happy to pay £15-20,000 for a car when the manufacter makes massive profit on them and they don't moan about that do they specially when they loses the massive depreciation value.
So let say you paid £3000 upgrade for a central heating system and lasted 10 yrs, that is only over £5 per week and this is only on 10 yrs. So don't you agree, it's very good value
Hot water and heating is my number one luxury item on top of my lists and yet people quite happy to pay £15-20,000 for a car when the manufacter makes massive profit on them and they don't moan about that do they specially when they loses the massive depreciation value.
So let say you paid £3000 upgrade for a central heating system and lasted 10 yrs, that is only over £5 per week
and this is only on 10 yrs. So don't you agree, it's very good value I've trained 3 yrs @ Uni for my Architectural degree + I've been working in a private practice for 6 yrs.
Yet sparky's, plumbers + brickies (all those i deal with on a daily basis on site) make over double what i'm making, + believe it or not I have a mortgage, car payments + expenses aswell..........+ then they openly take the p*ss about it on top.
Someone asked me to qoute for a double storey extension on a semi. The survey, application forms, planning drawings, building regs drawings, sourcing a builder will take about 25 hrs all in. I qouted £500 + they laughed at me.............now compare that to the specialist work u guys do, you have trained + worked as apprentices etc as I have. BUT you can charge alot more than I'm able to charge.
I've had a quote for a boiler (low range) + 7 rads for £3k fitted OMG and i'm in Leeds. Therefore you can't be surprised people are getting a bit upset about the quote's there getting. Keep qouting these ridiculous prices + see where it ends up............the polski's + europeans doing bodge jobs.........the whole system is a f*ck up + enjoy it while u can cos it won't last.
Yet sparky's, plumbers + brickies (all those i deal with on a daily basis on site) make over double what i'm making, + believe it or not I have a mortgage, car payments + expenses aswell..........+ then they openly take the p*ss about it on top.
Someone asked me to qoute for a double storey extension on a semi. The survey, application forms, planning drawings, building regs drawings, sourcing a builder will take about 25 hrs all in. I qouted £500 + they laughed at me.............now compare that to the specialist work u guys do, you have trained + worked as apprentices etc as I have. BUT you can charge alot more than I'm able to charge.
I've had a quote for a boiler (low range) + 7 rads for £3k fitted OMG
and i'm in Leeds. Therefore you can't be surprised people are getting a bit upset about the quote's there getting. Keep qouting these ridiculous prices + see where it ends up............the polski's + europeans doing bodge jobs.........the whole system is a f*ck up + enjoy it while u can cos it won't last. 
I think the Mini was about 750 GBP in 1970.
I asked an architect to quote JUST to produce drawings for Planning and BR for a single story rear extension 6m x 6m, on the basis I did all the site measurements and a video so no site visit would be necessary, price 3000 GBP !!! Please email me from my profile if you can do it at a sensible price please.
A simple legal agreement using a standard template, city firm 3500 GBP, local high street firm 300 GBP ( and I thought that was too high for ONE hour's work! ) But that their lowest price for anything!
Tony
I asked an architect to quote JUST to produce drawings for Planning and BR for a single story rear extension 6m x 6m, on the basis I did all the site measurements and a video so no site visit would be necessary, price 3000 GBP !!! Please email me from my profile if you can do it at a sensible price please.
A simple legal agreement using a standard template, city firm 3500 GBP, local high street firm 300 GBP ( and I thought that was too high for ONE hour's work! ) But that their lowest price for anything!
Tony
That`s Tradition...........the plebs on site have always taken the **** out of the suits with the hard hatspeca27 said:
......Get to 50 and you`ll see.....you`ll be better off than the tradesmen .....I know architects and managers etc. all in bigger houses than me .But i`ve still got ALL my hair on ma heed joe-90 said:
I totally agree, we should encourage these workers to come here and strip the wealth of our country so they can send it home then go back and share it around. We have had our share of the wealth and should now be driven into poverty, it will teach the spoilt brat, ungrateful youths a thing and hopefully some parents as well.
My uncles an architect and has houses in Bermuda, Bahamas and Devon so the pay can't be that bad.
Lesson in economics for all the numpty's moaning about what heating engineers & plumbers earn:
Don't mistake a heating engineer's TURNOVER figure for his or her's PROFIT for a job. If the job costs you £3k and the installer is forking out £1500 for boiler & radiators, then he's not making £3k on the job is he ?
Besides, its a market economy people, so what if someone is an architect / plastic surgeon / airline pilot or whatever - could any one of these people live without hot water, or get through the winter without their central heating??? I can live without getting my house extended!
I did 4 years at University, but that didn't give me the belief that I should be paid better than someone else. I then had to graft my bloomin ballcocks off to make a good go at this heating game when I changed career, now I'm paying all of the aforementioned bills (tax, insurance, time off work etc) and trying to get by.
Regarding your quoted prices, to decide whether or not they are reasonable, take the quoted price, deduct all expenses no matter how small (boiler, rads, amount of pipework & cable, pipe clips etc), estimate the installers weekly expenditure including all the costs that people forget that we have to fork out for (phone calls, fuel, insurances, wages paid, etc etc), then you will have arrived at:
the PROFIT the installer has made!!
Usually less than you think...
Don't mistake a heating engineer's TURNOVER figure for his or her's PROFIT for a job. If the job costs you £3k and the installer is forking out £1500 for boiler & radiators, then he's not making £3k on the job is he ?
Besides, its a market economy people, so what if someone is an architect / plastic surgeon / airline pilot or whatever - could any one of these people live without hot water, or get through the winter without their central heating??? I can live without getting my house extended!
I did 4 years at University, but that didn't give me the belief that I should be paid better than someone else. I then had to graft my bloomin ballcocks off to make a good go at this heating game when I changed career, now I'm paying all of the aforementioned bills (tax, insurance, time off work etc) and trying to get by.
Regarding your quoted prices, to decide whether or not they are reasonable, take the quoted price, deduct all expenses no matter how small (boiler, rads, amount of pipework & cable, pipe clips etc), estimate the installers weekly expenditure including all the costs that people forget that we have to fork out for (phone calls, fuel, insurances, wages paid, etc etc), then you will have arrived at:
the PROFIT the installer has made!!
Usually less than you think...
holidays
sick days
quoting time
design, paperwork
warranty
van
clothing
parts
tools
fuel
insurances
pension
tax / ni
vat
vehicle running costs / depreciation
lost jobs (part days)
subbie
training / registrations (lost job time & course costs)
I'm sure there is much more to add but this may serve as an indication to those who don't understand how it works to run a business which actually provides an end product. Instead of moaning about it why not come and do it?, it is money for nothing after all.
sick days
quoting time
design, paperwork
warranty
van
clothing
parts
tools
fuel
insurances
pension
tax / ni
vat
vehicle running costs / depreciation
lost jobs (part days)
subbie
training / registrations (lost job time & course costs)
I'm sure there is much more to add but this may serve as an indication to those who don't understand how it works to run a business which actually provides an end product. Instead of moaning about it why not come and do it?, it is money for nothing after all.
S
Soggy_weetabix
may I just add to this thread...
annual CORGI costs. (£236 ish at least)
ACS training costs every 5 years. (Costs vary wildly depending on the elements you require - for me its approx 2 grand)
Courses to ensure compentency in all plumbing work you do (namely unvented, energy efficiency..., part P etc). These are one off costs granted but are a factor.
And can we then allow for the 3-4 weeks (when all the doctors and architects are in their villa's on the Costa Bomb sunning it up) the gas engineer is sitting in some sweaty badly decorated office suite, on an industrial estate that sells sweaty food for fun - just so can moan about their price to replace your boiler.
Car crash telly is forcing this attitude on the general public.
David
annual CORGI costs. (£236 ish at least)
ACS training costs every 5 years. (Costs vary wildly depending on the elements you require - for me its approx 2 grand)
Courses to ensure compentency in all plumbing work you do (namely unvented, energy efficiency..., part P etc). These are one off costs granted but are a factor.
And can we then allow for the 3-4 weeks (when all the doctors and architects are in their villa's on the Costa Bomb sunning it up) the gas engineer is sitting in some sweaty badly decorated office suite, on an industrial estate that sells sweaty food for fun - just so can moan about their price to replace your boiler.
Car crash telly is forcing this attitude on the general public.
David
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Soggy_weetabix said:
Should work for a company then they get all these bills
I heard potterton are pretty good
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