New storage heaters

[bullethead123]

Hi all,
I've got a flat I rent out and, as I'm about to replace the carpets, I thought I'd replace the storage heaters too. Though they still work, the ones in situ are old (at least 22yrs) and discoloured. I was thinking to replace with electric radiators, as they are; cheaper to buy, easier to install (it's a third floor flat), and allow for greater user control (i.e. they are only switched on when heat is needed). however, I am concerned that these may be much more expensive to run than new storage heaters.
I have heard there are dual supply storage heaters on the market which should give the best of both worlds but it seems that the electricity companies give with one hand and take away with the other. A typical quote just obtained from the current supplier is 24.3p/KWh daytime and 5p/KWh off peak compared to a typical standard rate of around 15p/KWh.
Which way should I go - the electric radiators or the dual storage heaters?
Also, any product reccomendations for either would be welcomed.
Thanks,
Chris.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Beware. The storage rads will probably be on an economy tariff so that they only get electricity when you are asleep in bed. So, if you go for panel heaters, you’ll need a lot of work done to the consumer units, and much else. Or you’ll have a cold house when you are locked down or working from home.

better to go for the dual supply storage rads. Note that they connect to both the off peak supply and also will need connecting to a separate 24-hour electric feed.

 

[ETAF]

an elderly friend of mine, unfortunately was sold a system to replace all her storage heaters with normal radiators, which has resulted in an almost 3x electric bill from around 4K per year to nearly 12K. Mainly because she is on her own in an old 1900 cottage and likes the temp quite warm 25-27C.
the storage heaters worked well in the past , with an additional radiator in the lounge , but its been a disaster.
In fact a lot of the trust pilot reviews also complained about this.
Each radiator has a thermostat timer and the batteries need changing about every 6-8mths
very complicated for an 88 year old.
even if there had been a saving at almost 20K for the install , this would take longer than her lifetime to recover just the installation cost !!!!!!!
So be aware and look into the cost
I wish i had known before the contract was all finalised and the fitters on site .....

 

[flameport]

I have heard there are dual supply storage heaters on the market which should give the best of both worlds

All new storage heaters are dual supply, the old night only ones haven't been available for several years.

Storage heaters are cheaper if they are connected to E7 or a similar cheap overnight arrangement. Their disadvantage is that you have to heat the house for most/all of the day, which may not suit certain lifestyles.

Switch on as required heaters will cost significantly more to run if used for any length of time. If the property is empty most of the day and only heated for a few hours in the evening they may still be cheaper overall compared to storage heaters, but that's only because of the short time that the heat is used.

Otherwise installing day rate heating over night rate will always cost more for the same heat levels, and if used for most/all of the day it will cost significantly more.

Other things to avoid are those companies which claim their special radiators/heaters contain magical gels, cores, Italian aluminium and similar nonsense, and which by unexplained witchcraft use a quarter of the energy of other heaters and yet still provide the same heat output. It's all lies.
A 2kW fan heater costing £10 to buy will provide exactly the same amount of heat at the same cost as a fancy 2kW electric radiator that costs £100s.
The only real difference is that some heaters provide instant heat and stop instantly, others take a while to heat up and provide heat for a while after switching off, but the total heat output is the same.

Unless the old storage heaters are totally destroyed, it would be advisable to keep them. Most can be repaired if needed at a fraction of the cost of new ones, and they can be repainted if they are discoloured.

 

[bullethead123]

Thanks for the replies all. I think I've been convinced that I should stick with storage heaters rather than go for electric radiators.
I've gotta change them though, two of them have rust on the covers which inevitably fall down onto the carpet and, chatting to the tenants, it seems the storage heaters have lost their heat by mid evening. Thinking long term, they are good, long-term tenants who I'd like to keep and the lady who recently did the EPC suggested these Dimplex Quantum heaters: https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/DXQM100RF.html
They seem quite expensive though and the same company does these: https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/DXXLE100.html
Given I'd have to purchase 3, the latter would save me over £300. Can anyone offer an opinion on their relative merits or suggest alternatives?
Chris.

 

[endecotp]

Do you think your tenants are the sort of people who would like to be able to control their heating from an app on their phone?

 

[ETAF]

chatting to the tenants, it seems the storage heaters have lost their heat by mid evening.

Not an expert by any means, BUT i would expect storage heaters to have lost heat by mid evening - there is usually a knob to control the output which should be down when not in use
have a read here
https://www.wdh.co.uk/Documents/pl/...w to use your Storage Heaters Efficiently.pdf

 

[flameport]

Dimplex Quantum

They are very good heaters, but they are expensive and won't heat the room any better than the cheaper versions.

The standard Dimplex are virtually identical to the Creda ones, both being made by the same company. Creda are cheaper.
Elnur Gabarron are another option.

In all cases, they will need 2 electricity supplies, one off peak (which is what the old heaters use) and another one that's on all the time, so some additional wiring will be required.
It's also essential that the heaters are properly sized to the room, and that the building is insulated to a high standard.

 

[bullethead123]

Thanks for all the replies.
Had a quick google of the Creda and Elnur products. The Creda one does look identical to the standard Dimplex but is quite a bit cheaper and the Elnur offering is cheaper still. I'll have a closer look tomorrow.
As regards wiring, the off-peak wiring is obviously in situ and there are ring main sockets close to two of the heaters so a bit of extra wiring would be needed for the third I guess. I assume the peak connection can be made to a standard ring main socket. Is this correct?

 

[flameport]

I assume the peak connection can be made to a standard ring main socket

Yes, but the total load of the new heaters plus whatever else is connected to the circuit needs to be considered. Not usually a problem for a lightly loaded circuit that doesn't include the kitchen, however if it does include the kitchen it may require an additional circuit to to installed for the heaters, or put the kitchen on a separate one.

 

[bullethead123]

OK.
I've got to get a Sparks round to do the mandatory EIC within the next few months so I'll get him (or her) to check it out.
Thanks Flameport.

 

[Captain Nemesis]

In all cases, they will need 2 electricity supplies, one off peak (which is what the old heaters use) and another one that's on all the time, so some additional wiring will be required.

Isnt there an off-peak thing where its all the electricity at either night or day prices, not seperate wiring?

 

[Diver Fred]

The 'new' NSH(Dimplex Quantum et.al.) require 2 power supplies :-
1) independent (high load) supply to heat the unit up - on Low cost electricity - Economy Seven. There is no manual control of the amount of energy going in. Up to 3.5KW.
2) a constant supply - tipicaly off the household ring main to power the control electronics and the Fan to warm the room by circulating the room's air through the hot bricks heated up overnight on Economy 7. About 100watts normally but can be 1.5KW at times on exceptionally cold days (there is an additional fan heater in the NSH used when the hot brics can no longer heat the room).
In theory by setting the control timer and room temperature the hot bricks are still hot to warm the room into the late evening.

I am not convinced that such heaters are any more cost effective to run than the earlier manually controlled input NSH's.

 

[flameport]

Isnt there an off-peak thing where its all the electricity at either night or day prices, not seperate wiring?

Not any more, due to Lot20. https://professional-electrician.com/features/lot-20-arrived-need-know/

 

[Captain Nemesis]

How does that stop day/night tarrifs?