Newbie question - wires too short for ceiling spotlight!

[AdamW]

An even better way to wire domestic lighting would be to incorporate the function of the ceiling rose into the switch instead. OK, so this would be hard to retrofit into existing installations and would require a rewire of the lighting, but in new installations it would be great.

Instead of having two loop T&E's, a switch T&E and a lighting flex all going into the ceiling rose/JB, you would have two loop T&E's going through the switch and a lighting T&E coming off the switch. The equipment to do it is already there (ideally a DP switch) however it is somewhat lacking in aesthetics. You could even wire a standard switch to do it (although the neutral would be a bodge, so it wouldn't be good).

OK, so you might say this doesn't solve the problem as there are still several cables, but I think it would. If someone is replacing a switch, they have all the wires there that obviously go into their respective connectors. So when someone replaces a hanging light with a spot light, they just have a switched live and neutral pair.

 

[plugwash]

there are a few possibilitys here if you like this wiring style

1: normal lightswitch with chock block nutral.
2: normal lightswitch with crimped nutral
3: double pole switch

1 requires a deep box
2 reauires a decent crimper and the ability to use it properly
3 seems nice to me but you will spend more on the switches

the thing is the easiest place to run cables is the floor/cieling void so we wire our lightswitches in a way that involves running just one cable down the wall

another method that can be usefull if you need a light in a place where lighting cables are hard to get at is to run a 2.5mm cable from a socket to a fcu and from the fcu to the light (you can use a smaller cable here or just stick with the 2.5mm you used from the socket to the fcu). fit the fcu with a 3A fuse and use the switch on the fcu as your lightswitch

btw if your looking for double pole switches that look like lightswitches here

 

[AdamW]

there are a few possibilitys here if you like this wiring style

1: normal lightswitch with chock block nutral.
2: normal lightswitch with crimped nutral

These were the two I thought of, but didn't like. No doubt it is perfectly safe but I just don't like the idea of leaving a chock block in a box like that. I agree double pole would be better

the thing is the easiest place to run cables is the floor/cieling void so we wire our lightswitches in a way that involves running just one cable down the wall

Ah, but surely running three 1.5mm cables is not much more difficult than running one?

Well, I don't have a problem with ceiling roses. When you actually think about it they are very simple yet an elegant solution, not to mention easy to add and remove.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Plugwash - you do seem to sometimes take the idea of lateral thinking just a bit too far sideways. Lateral, or outside-the-box thinking can produce wonderful and novel solutions, but it can also produce less-than ideal alternatives to existing solutions, like your idea of intermediate switches and ordinary dimmers instead of proper 2-way dimmers.

And now this. Leaving aside the price and heavy action of 20A DP switches, and the fact that they have flex outlets (neither of which would be an issue if they actually started making DP light switches), think of the space they need. Do you think you could get a 3-gang 2-way DP switch (18 terminals), or a 2-gang intermediate (16 terminals) into an 85mm x 85mm format? Could you get a 2-gang 2-way into an architrave size? How big would the 6C+E cable be that you'd need for multi-way switching?

DP switches are not the answer. Now - if we abandoned T/E for the cabling and had a 1C+E looping from switch to switch and going to the lights, for live, and a 1C+E looping fron light to light with the neutral, that would work.

But the current system is pretty elegant, and simple. If people can't get their heads round it, then they shouldn't be doing it themselves.

 

[Big_Spark]

DP switches are not the answer. Now - if we abandoned T/E for the cabling and had a 1C+E looping from switch to switch and going to the lights, for live, and a 1C+E looping fron light to light with the neutral, that would work.

But the current system is pretty elegant, and simple. If people can't get their heads round it, then they shouldn't be doing it themselves.

Unfortunately Ban your system would not work either, all phase conductors MUST have a NEUTRAL or Switched Live accompany it. A single core and E would not meet the Regs.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I'm curious - what's the reasoning behind that?

And why are single-core cables made?