noise like a thundering "waterfall" after neighbou

[juliechoupi]

Hi there,

I am a bit worried as I've just bought a ground floor flat (in a block of flats), and I keep on being awaken at random hours of the night by what seems to be a thundering waterfall noise or fountain or a sound like water really falling hard (a bit like if some heavy rain was falling very fast on a shower screen) behind my walls in both of my bathrooms.

Sorry for the description, it's really hard to put words on it and every time I talk about this to someone they simply say that it's normal to hear noises on a ground floor but this noise is very different from the "normal" noises I can hear when other neighbours flush or open their water ("smooth" noise of water running behind the tiled wall in the pipes).

It almost seems like the water would be falling out of the pipes and hitting the drywall. Now, it is just a description of the "kind of noise" it is, as if it really was running out of the pipes and hittings my walls, all the tiles would come off I imagine and the water damage would be very visible.

This noise doesn't last very long. But again, the duration varies and it seems random. I have no idea what it is and would like to get advice from a plumber or somebody who had the exact same problem please.
Could this be a leak from their toilet? Is possible that it would come from other neighbours than the 1st floor?

I sometimes also hear like a humming noise that lasts forever after the "waterfall" noise.

Many many thanks, as your reply might reconciliate me with sleep!

P.S.:
- the building is 5 years old so I do believe the pipes will be plastic or ABS
- I do hear two type of noises when water is running down: the "smooth" and "normal" type of water running down the pipes for a short period of time
AND
the loud noise of water that sounds like it's hitting the walls or the ceiling and which is very different

All help appreciated! Thank you

 

[Newboy]

From your descriptions

It sounds like a toilet flush from a higher floor (how many floors in the building?)

The "smoother" sound may well be from a basin or sink just running.

The humming noise is probably a vibration from a toilet cistern inlet valve - hence why you hear it after the waterfall noise.

It may be possible to muffle the sounds by either boxing in the pipework or adding insulation inside existing boxing

 

[juliechoupi]

From your descriptions

It sounds like a toilet flush from a higher floor (how many floors in the building?)

The "smoother" sound may well be from a basin or sink just running.

The humming noise is probably a vibration from a toilet cistern inlet valve - hence why you hear it after the waterfall noise.

It may be possible to muffle the sounds by either boxing in the pipework or adding insulation inside existing boxing

Hello newboy,

Thanks a million for your answer!

I believe there is 3 or 4 floors above me....

Your explanation makes perfect sense and to be honest, I was really hoping it would be that rather than a leak from any of the toilets above!

Is it normal though that this very loud sound almost like water is hitting my ceiling or the wall behind my tiles would last for different time each time? from few seconds to several minutes?

Thank you very much for your patience and help!

 

[Burnerman]

I think NB is absolutely correct - plastic pipes are thin and its often an issue, if not exactly a problem, in hotels and the like.
You'd soon know if there were any leaks, not to mention the pong!
Other noises can come from waste disposal units fitted to sinks, and mascerating type toilets.
John

 

[Madrab]

I get exactly the same from the flats above me, there is a shared soil stack in the corner of my bathroom. If the toilet is flushed it sounds like a waterfall for about 20 secs, if the bath is emptied it sounds waterfall but carries on for a couple of mins until the bath empties. I don't really hear it now after 10 years

 

[algas]

The humming noise is probanly the w/c fan with the timer set on max

 

[juliechoupi]

Hi all,


Thank you very much for reassuring me! Especially Madrab....if it has been going on for 10 years then I guess you do get used to it once you've ruled out any major leak issue it could be!
Does it sometimes last more than few minutes? And are you also able to differentiate that noise from "normal smooth" noise of water running?

Because it sounds to me that the thundering waterfall type of noise only happens randomly and that otherwise when somebody flushed or run water, it's just a "normal" noise down the pipes behind the walls.

I know it is a bit hard to describe on a post, so thank you very much for your answers.

 

[Madrab]

Depends on the volume of water running down the pipe I would think. There could be anything connected to the stack, a shower, toilet, bath, sink etc and each one would produce a different noise depending on the flow of water. It would also change if more than one flat is draining into that stack at the same time.
Unless you are getting lots of water everywhere then I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[juliechoupi]

Depends on the volume of water running down the pipe I would think. There could be anything connected to the stack, a shower, toilet, bath, sink etc and each one would produce a different noise depending on the flow of water. It would also change if more than one flat is draining into that stack at the same time.
Unless you are getting lots of water everywhere then I wouldn't worry about it.

Thank you Rob, I'm sure you can understand how worried I was when I wrote that post.
It is really nice to talk to someone who had the same experience..

I'll watch for any sign of water showing (although the bathroom is tiled so it will be quite hard to notice.. any tips to know if there's water behind tiles - apart from the tiles being loose and falling of the walls of course)

Julie

 

[Onetap]

I think NB is absolutely correct - plastic pipes are thin and its often an issue, if not exactly a problem, in hotels and the like.

True, but the Building Regulations have requirements for sound insulation on foul drains, specifically to stop such noise breakout.

If the noise is from a foul drain, I'd suspect that the sound insulation does not meet the Building Regulations standards and the builder could be liable.

 

[Newboy]

Agreed - but it depends on how old the building is. We have similar issues in a block of flats built in the '80s and have retro fitted sound deadening around the stacks whenever a flat is refurbed.

 

[Onetap]

Agreed - but it depends on how old the building is.

5 years the OP said.

 

[juliechoupi]

Agreed - but it depends on how old the building is. We have similar issues in a block of flats built in the '80s and have retro fitted sound deadening around the stacks whenever a flat is refurbed.

Hi Newboy,

Yes, like onetap said, the building is only 5 years old.

Is there any way I can check if it has been properly insulated without having to tear off all walls and tiles in the bathrooms? (for i.e., under the bathtub?) And also, what would I be looking for? (steel wool?)

Thank you all!
Julie

 

[Onetap]

Is there any way I can check if it has been properly insulated without having to tear off all walls and tiles in the bathrooms? (for i.e., under the bathtub?) And also, what would I be looking for? (steel wool?)

The common services (drains, water supply, gas, etc., ) would probably be enclosed in a services duct which would be accessible for maintenance and inspection from the public areas. The maintenance contractors or caretaker should have a key, if there is such a duct.

Usually all the toilets and bathrooms would be stacked above one another, so they could all easily connect to the soil and vent pipe.

You would be looking for an enclosure and mineral wool insulation, as in the Building Regulations, Building Regulations, Approved Document E - Resistance to the passage of sound Approved Document E - Resistance to the passage of sound. Available on-line here;

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_AD_E_2010.pdf

Sections 3.41 to 3.42 are relevant, and particularly diagram 3.6.

If it doesn't conform to that, the builders are probably liable (if they're still trading, etc., ).

This assumes the problem is noise breakout from drains, which may not be the case. I'd thought it might be a shower pump.