On a slightly different tack, don't you think you should have had a chat upfront about the plants being "right in the way", and the laurel "that had to come off"? Might save some hassle in the future, and a disappointed customer. Getting the job done is one part of the job, another part is keeping your customers happy.
Not getting paid and paying for materials?
- Thread starter newhandyman
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And do what?
What the OP receives or how he receives it is irrelevant until a tax return is submitted, in terms of the HMRC.
You should have discussions about plants etc, prior to starting. When we did the patio below, I couldn't help noticing the pristine condition of the gardens. I made the customer aware of the potential for damage both to the lawn and the border plants and shrubs. We agreed on what was sacrificial and what needed moving prior to getting the digger and wheel barrows round. We used plywood sheeting where necessary.
Lesson learnt. Offer him a discount then hound him for the rest.
My gaffer is owed £60k on a job he completed 8 months ago. £40k on another job that was completed 6 months ago.
He spent £20k on insulated cladding panels for a customer a few months ago and then the customer cancelled the job. And now he's lumbered with the panels and no customer.
He is owed £9k on a roofing job that was bodged (trusses too weak and roof bowed) and another £5k on another roofing job that was bodged also.
Which he'll never see. And probably be taken to court for the former as it will require about £30k just to rectify.
And still waiting on payment for another 3 completed jobs that total about £100k.
How he stays in business is a miracle. He's in his seventies now and not in good health. Employs about 15 and is in debt to no one.
Apart from the customers left with bodges.
Some customers bring bodges on themselves wanting the cheapest price possible.
And plenty deserve being left with a bodge. Pay peanuts and you get monkeys. lol.
He spent £20k on insulated cladding panels for a customer a few months ago and then the customer cancelled the job. And now he's lumbered with the panels and no customer.
He is owed £9k on a roofing job that was bodged (trusses too weak and roof bowed) and another £5k on another roofing job that was bodged also.
Which he'll never see. And probably be taken to court for the former as it will require about £30k just to rectify.
And still waiting on payment for another 3 completed jobs that total about £100k.
How he stays in business is a miracle. He's in his seventies now and not in good health. Employs about 15 and is in debt to no one.
Apart from the customers left with bodges.
Some customers bring bodges on themselves wanting the cheapest price possible.
And plenty deserve being left with a bodge. Pay peanuts and you get monkeys. lol.
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D
Doggit
Sounds like you and the other workers need to go and have a chat with those "clients", before you all have to start looking for other jobs.
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There does seem to be a theme in that last example. At the end of the day if you take on a job for a price you are down for it, unless there are scope changes. If you can't do it for the price don't take it on. You can't cap your liability to fees paid if you negligently under build and end up causing more harm than the value of the job.
Let us know how it goes OP. You've had plenty of good advice.
Sorry this has happened to you as it's a steep learning curve for your first job and a real downer for what should be a really exciting thing.
Sorry this has happened to you as it's a steep learning curve for your first job and a real downer for what should be a really exciting thing.
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I knocked off some of the labour and he eventually paid. I have leant from this. Regarding getting customer to pay for matrials. U say it's not a good idea to take their credit card to the shop but how else do u get them to pay? For example your at Travis Perkins and materials is £ 500. Do I call up customer and get him to pay over phone?
My brother works as a bathroom fitter in Milton Keynes and he wasn't paid; neither were the other tradesmen. He said most jobs are done on trust. No contract
It didn't go to court. Apparently, the electricians broke his arms.
What do most people do when they run the job. Small jobs. And have someone helping them? Officially you're now limited company aren't u?
My brother works as a bathroom fitter in Milton Keynes and he wasn't paid; neither were the other tradesmen. He said most jobs are done on trust. No contract
It didn't go to court. Apparently, the electricians broke his arms.
What do most people do when they run the job. Small jobs. And have someone helping them? Officially you're now limited company aren't u?
Payment can be done in stages on larger jobs.
Smaller jobs are done with payment on completion or part payment up front to at least cover materials.
All depends on the job, price or customer.
Andy
Smaller jobs are done with payment on completion or part payment up front to at least cover materials.
All depends on the job, price or customer.
Andy
How was he going to pay you - by credit card? No? Cash most probably. If the materials are £500 you want £500 cash up front or a cheque but DONT buy the materials until the cheque has cleared.
D
Doggit
Well I'm glad you got most of the money; at least it didn't go too bad.
For future jobs, you need to get something in writing, even if you only jot it down on a notepad that you keep with you. Get yourself a set of terms and conditions typed out that you can add to the quicl writte quote, and make sure clients know that you'll play straight, but don't intend to be messed around. Tell them bluntly that you ask for the cost of materials up front, simply because you've been stitched up before, but you'll accept the balance of the job when it's completed. But if they're not happy to give you the money for meterials, then they can either go with you to get them, or you give them a list, and they get them themselves.
For future jobs, you need to get something in writing, even if you only jot it down on a notepad that you keep with you. Get yourself a set of terms and conditions typed out that you can add to the quicl writte quote, and make sure clients know that you'll play straight, but don't intend to be messed around. Tell them bluntly that you ask for the cost of materials up front, simply because you've been stitched up before, but you'll accept the balance of the job when it's completed. But if they're not happy to give you the money for meterials, then they can either go with you to get them, or you give them a list, and they get them themselves.
Indeed, most building supply places, from "trade account only" merchants to Wickes/BnQ will deliver. Most "fence posts direct" internet places are just a front end web store (possibly run by a housewife from her front room) for a larger merchant or manufacturer that will that will drop-ship all over the place
Customer can buy materials and arrange delivery then get you in to fit them; there's no excuse in the Internet age for getting stuck with a materials bill. If the customer won't stump up for materials in advance it's a good indication of what will happen to your invoice come the end of the job
Customer can buy materials and arrange delivery then get you in to fit them; there's no excuse in the Internet age for getting stuck with a materials bill. If the customer won't stump up for materials in advance it's a good indication of what will happen to your invoice come the end of the job
a lot of it is down to experience, after a while in the game you can gauge how to deal with customers, the ones that you need to be strict with and those you can give a bit more trust to. You will find your feet and a system that works according to the type of works you do.
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If you take a customers credit card to the shop and use it to pay for materials (with their consent) they are in breach of the card terms and by presenting yourself as them to the shop, you are potentially commuting fraud. They would be processing the payment card holder present, which is your deception. Further the card holder might later say you didn't have his consent, which might expose you to a theft allegation. As others have said. In the age of the internet, you can sit them down with an ipad and build up their bill of material and get them to pay or you ask for an initial payment to cover materials. Hopefully you'll find alternative to travis perkins who are over priced normally. However, your safe/legal option is to call the customer and get them to deal with the payment over the phone and allow TP to process.
In terms of establishing a contract. You can still function on trust/oral agreement, but you protect yourself if you write down, what they are asking you to do. e.g. supply and install 6M of wood fence with concrete posts to a height of 2M, remove and dispose of existing fence. Estimate 2 days at £200 per day + £500 materials (est) or Total price £1100 and either get them to email agreement or sign it. You don't need a signed paper contract, you can email them and get them to confirm they wont to go ahead.
You are a limited company if you form a limited company and you commit an offence if you present yourself as one when you aren't.
I'd get public liability insurance too.
Giving someone a kicking who wont pay a bill, will probably end up with you sitting in prison and not getting your money.
Another alternative is to get the customer to pay for materials upon materials turning up, or you bringing them. I've used this method before when I had a doubt over the customer intentions
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