Off topic. Bring it here.

[jeds]

the thames is tidal, up to Teddington.

what do you think the Thames Barrage is for?

? The level of the Thames doesn't indicate global average sea level.

 

[Notch7]

Hardly anybody really understands global temperature and climate change, and that includes the climatologists. Most good ones will tell you that. Part of the problem is dramatic statements made in the past have not come to fruition, and that fuels the non-believers into thinking it doesn't exist at all. Thirty years ago it was predicted that global average temperature would increase by 2 degrees within 20 years. In fact it increased by 0.2 degrees. A big error. Much of the problem is how and what is measured. People get confused between air temperature, surface temperature, sea temperature, sea temperature at depth, very deep sea temperature, and so on.

Weather people always dismiss cold spells which, to non-believers, is having your cake and eating it. You can't say 'global warming' when it's uncharacteristically hot and then say, ahh, that's different, that's the weather', when it's uncharacteristically cold. For 12 or 15 years in the early noughties the average global temperature stayed steady. Hardly any increase at all. The reason is unclear? probably just due to poorly understood vagaries of the global system. But this is a problem because for years climatologists drummed it into us that global warming was a direct response to C02 and because C02 was rising off the scale then temperature would rise with it. But it didn't, and that is more fuel to the non-believers. Ask most people what percentage of C02 in the atmosphere is caused by humans, most will say something like; 50%, 75%, 80%, etc. The vast majority will be above 50%. In fact it's less than 5%. At times lower than 2.5%.

Rising sea levels also a problem. Thirty years ago the Aussies were concerned about rising sea levels so much they set up a monitoring system across Australia and several surrounding islands. Thirty years later dramatic rising sea levels haven't materialised. A report about ten years ago said they detected barely any rise at all. The report didn't say so but it sounded like they were scratching their heads. Meanwhile, some South Pacific islands have virtually disappeared, but it's the Aussie no-show that is fuel for the non-believers.

So the problem with climate change is really about information and how it's presented. Years ago we were told the red light on your telly is causing climate change. It wasn't difficult to think that's a load of rubbish and bin all climate change theories along with it. These days you've got Greta sailing around the World in her yacht telling us we're all going to die if we don't stop travelling. That should do the trick.

Very interesting, thank you.

Every so often I get climate change deniers, who post temperature graphs going back hundreds of years - so they can claim: “it’s not climate change, it’s just people who are looking at a short term blip”

Ive always believed climate change is real, but the arguments the deniers put forward do seem plausible and hard to disprove.

 

[mitch66]

Ive always believed climate change is real, but the arguments the deniers put forward do seem plausible and hard to disprove.

Just out of interest Notch, what do you think was responsible for climate change for the 4.5 billion years before the last 100 years or so? Do you think it's odd that the reason for all that climate change for millions of years has now stopped and now it's humans burning coal at fault? Don't get me wrong there is massive pollution and no doubt a contribution to climate issues from humans but seeing as it appears to be humankinds fault now what did cause it before??

 

[Bodd]

Wasn't what is now the UK once tropical?

 

[Captain Nemesis]

None. What's yours?

None.

Which is why I choose not to disbelieve what thousands of experts and hundreds of scientific bodies tell me.

You, on the other hand.....

 

[Captain Nemesis]

There is a strong scientific consensus that the Earth is warming and that this warming is mainly caused by human activities. This consensus is supported by various studies of scientists' opinions and by position statements of scientific organizations, many of which explicitly agree with the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) synthesis reports.

Nearly all actively publishing climate scientists (97–98%) support the consensus on anthropogenic climate change, and the remaining 2% of contrarian studies either cannot be replicated or contain errors.

A 2019 study found scientific consensus to be at 100%.

Since 2007, when the American Association of Petroleum Geologists released a revised statement, no longer does any national or international scientific body reject the findings of human-induced effects on climate change.

And yet people who know nothing about it think it is sensible and rational to cast doubt on the opinions of all those people who do know about it. Its laughable.

 

[Mottie]

Wasn't what is now the UK once tropical?

Where I walk my dog in Essex there are loads of pebbles. Information boards tell that it was pebbles from the sea bed when they were picked up by the creep of ice from the sea which got as far as Essex in the last ice age. It’s been getting warmer ever since, apparently.

 

[mitch66]

And yet people who know nothing about it think it is sensible and rational to cast doubt on the opinions of all those people who do know about it. Its laughable.

I see your point. Any idea what caused climate change prior to about 150 years ago then? Maybe you could send me a link to one of the many sources that can explain it??

 

[Captain Nemesis]

What would be the point?

Is there anything that anybody can say to you to cause you to abandon your laughably ignorant refusal to believe all the thousands of experts?

 

[JohnD]

? The level of the Thames doesn't indicate global average sea level.

no

but it does indicate water level in the thames estuary.

And indications go back hundreds of years.

 

[fillyboy]

no

but it does indicate water level in the thames estuary.

And indications go back hundreds of years.

Only when the tide's in.

 

[noseall]

Thats why I voted Brexit

It's more plausible than your other attempts at an excuse.

 

[Bodd]

It's more plausible than your other attempts at an excuse.

 

[mitch66]

What would be the point?

Is there anything that anybody can say to you to cause you to abandon your laughably ignorant refusal to believe all the thousands of experts?

I take it you couldn't come up with anything?

 

[Vinty]

A 2019 study found scientific consensus to be at 100%.

Among those who agreed.