One of the reasons our country is going down the toilet

[pipme]

IMHO Airbus would probably never have got off the ground had the Concorde project not paved the way.... a real Boeing competitor.

If C Mk2 had been built it would have incorporated much more environmentaly friendly engines etc.

If you look at an F1 car from the sixties against those of today, they look pretty dated. C never really looked that

TSR2 Preceded me.

Mariines ------ Pegasus >>>> VSTOL !!

There we go again ... from "Rang some company today.." to VSTOL
P

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I personally think it is rather sad, looking at that magnificent old lump and thinking it will never fly again.

It's a bit like looking at a picture of someone you know who's died..or is that too melodramatic?

No - it is very sad. Despite the fact that I'd probably never have gone in it again, I do very much regret that I'll never see it fly again. And that future generations will never see it fly at all. One memory I will always have is from quite a small airshow around 30 years ago, when Concorde came and did a low level pass along the crowd line, (at an illegally low altitude) with afterburners on. Spectacular does not begin to describe it.

Whether Branson could have made a go of it commercially we'll never know, but even if it was right that he wasn't given the chance, I think it is an act of monumental historical vandalism not to keep one or two flying. There are air museums up and down the country that manage to keep old planes flying - if we can manage airworthy Wellingtons, and a privately owned and operated Vulcan for heaven's sake, I'm sure that we could keep Concorde where it was meant to be - in the air.

 

[pipme]

I remember Trubshaw piloting C in formation with a Tornado at low level, both on afterburn, matching the fighter in a tightish circuit banked up on a wingtip ...... Awesome ... Riding the thunder !!

There was a whisper, unsubstantiated, that Trubs, had barrel-rolled her once .... caramba !!

P

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Properly done, a barrel roll places virtually no stress on the airframe - in fact, when perfectly done, if you were a passenger, and you had your eyes closed, you'd not be able to tell it was happening. You might feel a small amount of increased G, but you'd never suspect you were rolling. I saw a guy on TV once demonstrate this in some 6-seater twin (Cessna 3xx or similar) - his party trick was to place a glass on the top of the instrument cowl, and while in a barrel-roll (flying one-handed), he'd pour water from a bottle held a good 12" away into the glass. Very impressive.

Anyway - Concorde was probably designed to withstand a couple of G at least - if BT was able to pull a steep turn without the wings falling off then he could have barrel rolled it without a worry.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

IMHO Airbus would probably never have got off the ground had the Concorde project not paved the way.... a real Boeing competitor.

Well - the Anglo-French aspect was refined by Concorde, but do you not think that it consumed design and engineering capabilities, manufacturing capacity, political will and funding at a time when if they'd been directed at wide-bodies we'd have had a Boeing competitor much earlier? Look at our track record - we had the first jet airliner, we had the skills to do Concorde (which the Americans couldn't do), look how much better the Lightning was than the F-104. We had world-beating abilities, and whilst my heart says Concorde was a fabulous thing to do, my head says we'd have been better off trying to bury Boeing.

 

[pipme]

We seem never to have made the best of our lead in any sphere.
I guess if we use the same formulations and measures of success we end up in the same place .....
Many in the industry beleive that the French connection forged through Concorde was fundamental to the success of Airbus.
Anyway just look at our railway system .... made the best of that lead too didn't we ?
Ship building ..... it goes on !!

Honda have slipped quietly into the jet engine business .. ominous !!

P.

 

[AdamW]

My most memorable Concorde memory was standing in a queue at the Hertz building late at night at Heathrow airport. I heard a rumble, looked round just in time to see Concorde blaze past with blue cones hanging out of the jet pipes... it was pitch black outside and to me the image of it launching into the sky is up there with Harrier taking off vertically and current generation fighters performing ballistic take-offs. Very, very cool!

Pip, you forgot the underground too! I read a website about "metro" systems around the world, this American guy maintained it and his ambition was to ride the Tube. Boy was he disappointed when he found the city that started it all had neglected it for so long.

And about the barrel roll - a common-or-garden airliner, despite being a very stable airframe optimised for flying in a straight line at 600mph, can perform rather agile manoeuvers considering its size. The load factors you get in turbulence can be 3 or 4g, so a continuous factor of 2g would be no problem.

 

[pipme]

Enjoyed the metro (& S'pore sling !) in Suanapore, .... Fully air conditioned platforms ... Cool !!
Air-con train in Malaysia 32°C outside, pressing humidity ... Had to wear a sweater so bl--dy cold !!!

P

 

[pipme]

if BT was able to pull a steep turn without the wings falling off then he could have barrel rolled it without a worry.

What ? Under the old Severn bridge, at night ....... Low tide though !

P

 

[masona]

My most memorable Concorde memory was at the Southend seafront airshow a few years ago which I shall never forget.

With special permission the Concorde came down at 100 metres above the sea level on the seafront and you could even see the pilot waving !
Absolutely breathtaking !

 

[pipme]

That is the wonder of Concorde !!

Almost everyone had a soft spot / exciting memory of her ......

I remember the crowds, on a bleak Nov day when she finally returned to Bristol, all vantage points on high ground (Dundry hill) to the south of the city were filled with onlookers, the group where I found myself had travelled up to 35 miles !!

I marvelled at the interest .... thinking, if this ship is grounded forever someone somewhere just does not have their finger on the pulse of the nation ..... Talisman ... Flagship, whatever.

P

 

[pipme]

For B-A-S. and interested parties.
ref Civil airliner barrel roll.

Looks like Boeing may well have been first ... Boeing Dash 80 (707 prototype) ... Not once but twice, before a huge crowd too !!
http://www.boeing.com/news/frontiers/archive/2003/october/i_ca1.html

I believe old Tex the test pilot, was sacked on the spot by his boss, who was accompanied by potential buyers ... Then reinstated following the excitement generated.
Lots of the right stuff !!

P

 

[AdamW]

As someone brought up on high-bypass ratio turbofans, those old turbojet airliners just look weird to me. The engines appear far too tiny!

And look at the sh*t coming out of the 707 engines!


I like the following picture, comparing a 737 with the engine of a 777, very impressive

Can't wait to see the A380 in service... just a shame that we won't see anything bigger without a change in regulations, the A380 is about as long as a plane is allowed to be.

 

[pipme]

Suck - squeeze - bang - Blow

Biiger suck, less bang more blow !!

Is all there is to it.

P

 

[AdamW]

Suck - squeeze - bang - Blow

Biiger suck, less bang more blow !!

Is all there is to it.

P

Indeed that is the case. Even fighter jets go the turbofan route now, but at much lower bypass ratios.