Qualification

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Morning lads,

I've been toying with the idea of getting qualified in a trade, to give me the ability to carry out my own work in that field, and to give myself secondary income. I like the idea of doing electrical work, and from what I've seen I can do the courses part time (must fit in with leave periods).

Has anyone had any experiences of doing these part time courses, and if so, do you believe they give you at least a foundation skill set to enable you to work independently?

A consideration I can't ignore, is do you believe it's feasible to do part time work (Evenings, weekends, and in 2-3 week chunks) in said field? I imagine it mostly comes down to how I generate work, and how diligent I am in getting out in those times and doing quotes, and also getting on with the work? But obviously, not experienced in the trade, is their something I'm not foreseeing?

Cheers for any help!
 
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I imagine it mostly comes down to how I generate work, and how diligent I am in getting out in those times and doing quotes, and also getting on with the work?

But way ahead of these minor issues, the first thing that you will need to get competent in electrical work!
I would want someone who has a heap more than a 'foundation skill' before I let them loose in my house.

Look at taking time to gain a City and Guilds qualification in Electrical Installation. Its a vocational qualification with practical and theory modules. 2357 may be the direction to look at.
 
I have worked in firms who wanted their staff be be multi-skilled, training electricians in basic mechanics and mechanics in basic electrics, the training was for health and safety so workers did not do something which would endanger themself or others, however it was so we could help each other rather than do each others jobs. With an electrical job the mechanic became an electricians mate, and with a mechanical job the electrician became a mechanics mate.

Working like that over time the pair would learn each others trade like any apprentice would, and to then take formal qualifications in the others trade would make them multi-skilled. However simply going to collage is not enough.

When my dad was young he went to night class, there were courses in most collages to do this, but by time it came to my turn we had day release, so the courses were not run at night, today hard to find day release courses as most are block release. I did a course to become a heavy plant mechanic, when I got on the course then government run I found it rather simplistic, it was to be for 24 weeks as I remember, I got called in to see the Principle of the collage, it transpired with my qualifications I could have instructed the course, because if I left incomplete I could never do another, it was shortened and I used the collage to send out 100's of CV's and stopped doing the course.

The idea was when you left you went to work with others of the same trade, so you had people to ask if you got stuck, theory OK, in practice other workers took the attitude they are paid the same as me, if they can't do the job then why should I help them. Some people were lucky and they did get people to help them. But many found it hell.

Today you do find the odd firm who will take on semi-skilled, mainly domestic, they get the semi-skilled to wire houses and have an inspector who tours around the sites ensuring all is done correct, my son for a time worked as an inspector, he found it a real problem, he could not believe what things the semi-skilled got wrong, and these who went before you, have resulted in very few firms being willing to continue to employ semi-skilled any more.

This means in the main the only way to get work is as a sole trader, without the back-up of fellow workers any faults go unnoticed, this caused huge problems in the domestic side of the trade, as people are gullible and will pay for idiots to do work for them, as a result Part P building regulations were brought in, although not all work needs registering, jobs tend to expand, you go to a house to fit a socket, and then find a whole load of work needs doing before you can fit that simple socket, with LABC fees of £200 it can mean you can't afford to do the job unless you join a scheme so you can self certify, now there are two problems, one you have an annual fee, so to pay that fee you must do a fair bit of work, so hardly worth going part time as still have to pay the fee. And second you have to show you have the skill to be allowed to join. It in real terms replaced the Union closed shop system, what the Unions did and Thatcher stopped them removing their powers, has now been replaced by scheme providers. Just like in the old days it was hard to get into a trade union without an apprenticeship, today you have same problem getting into a scheme.

There is a valid route for allied trades, in the main people who are working alongside electricians every day, and have learn much of the trade before going to collage, I would also think where something drastic stops you doing your original job, struck off doctor for example, you could get into the trade by doing a full time course, but as a side line not really suitable, look as something like window cleaning or taxi driving for part time jobs.
 
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But way ahead of these minor issues, the first thing that you will need to get competent in electrical work!
I would want someone who has a heap more than a 'foundation skill' before I let them loose in my house.

Look at taking time to gain a City and Guilds qualification in Electrical Installation. Its a vocational qualification with practical and theory modules. 2357 may be the direction to look at.

That's the plan, I've saw some courses that do part time learning. That's the route I'll go down, being able to fit it in around work will be tricky but some providers say they can sort that. I should point out, I wont be paying for it, so I'm willing to gamble it, if only to get the skill set to do my own work in my own property.

It is this reason, and the intention to pick up irregular jobs when I can. When I talk about part time, I don't mean a 2nd job, I'm talking about if I mate has a job on and he needs a spark in, I could jump in, or small jobs doing lights, plugs etc. I will be looking to do at least another trade to support my own goals and to support existing trade. Another string to my bow, essentially.

I'm looking for any brickwalls I may hit on the way.
 
Trade education in this country is an absolute disgrace in my view. I think you are better off scouring ads like gumtree for electrican's mate jobs, even if it means less than minimum wage, even if it means working for free. Give it a few months of hard searching and try your best to land something. Only then start thinking about certification schemes, because on their own they are useless, expensive garbage. Sorry but it's the truth. C&G is a barrier to learning if anything because what you learn there, if anything at all, often does not apply to real life situations and the modules are designed to rob you of independent thought so that you become shy about using your own initiative and common sense. It also gives you unrealistic expectations regarding site, as H&S is drummed into you in a cultish fashion. When/if you ever do start work in the real world the contrast between what you were told and what you find will shock you. The majority of tutors will be lazy, disinterested and outdated, sometimes you get the odd one that isn't. It's more likely to put you off than anything else. Get yourself on site, somehow, by any means, it's the best possible route. Sorry to be bleak, but rather this than waste your time. Trust me I learnt the hard way.
 
I'm always intrigued by these "I want to be an electrician" threads.


Do you actually know how to do it already - and so only have to learn the rules and numbers - in which case being a mate would be possible or

do you know absolutely nothing about it?
 
I'm always intrigued by these "I want to be an electrician" threads.


Do you actually know how to do it already - and so only have to learn the rules and numbers - in which case being a mate would be possible or

do you know absolutely nothing about it?
I know nothing, I can only change the face plates on switches and sockets, and change light fittings. Even then I'm sweating in case I blow up, mains is off for all of it, rather than a particular circuit.
 
A day in the life of a domestic spark. You turn up at some ones house, smart casually dressed. The faults in the loft and it's the middle of summer, loft temp 40+c. You sort problem but are now soaked in sweat, filthy dirty from scrambling round in 100 years of dust. In the winter you get just as filthy but your frozen stiff.
Have a nice day:D
Electrical work is generally not a nice clean job, especially domestic.
 
Well, that's honest.

How old are you?
30 in November.

A day in the life of a domestic spark. You turn up at some ones house, smart casually dressed. The faults in the loft and it's the middle of summer, loft temp 40+c. You sort problem but are now soaked in sweat, filthy dirty from scrambling round in 100 years of dust. In the winter you get just as filthy but your frozen stiff.
Have a nice day:D
Electrical work is generally not a nice clean job, especially domestic.

I'll be fine with working conditions (y)
 
Young enough to spend time learning. You really need an apprenticeship or full time course before embarking on work in other people's houses.

However, I really don't know what to advise when learning everything from scratch.

I know it's not done these days but I think you'll find that a lot of (most?) electricians tinkered and played with things electrical when growing up so they sort of knew what they were doing when they chose to be electricians.
 
I know nothing, I can only change the face plates on switches and sockets, and change light fittings. Even then I'm sweating in case I blow up, mains is off for all of it, rather than a particular circuit.

Why exactly have you selected electrical work as diy hobby/second income?
Are you aware of any of the regulations and know anything about testing, even changing faceplates would require establishing some readings via testing. I would never change a socket plate without measuring the Zs and if a ring the end to end and r1&r2.

If learning from scratch, firstly get your hands dirty with someone with knowledge of the trade. You may find it is not your cuppa tea!
 
Young enough to spend time learning. You really need an apprenticeship or full time course before embarking on work in other people's houses.

However, I really don't know what to advise when learning everything from scratch.

I know it's not done these days but I think you'll find that a lot of (most?) electricians tinkered and played with things electrical when growing up so they sort of knew what they were doing when they chose to be electricians.
This was the type of advice I was after. What I wanted to know really, was these courses on offer that offer you the chance to be fully qualified on paper, is that sufficient to begin to start work. Most of them require you to complete practical on the job experience that is supervised and signed off by a qualified person. As for prior experience, before training, I have none other than basic science from school, and a bit of common sense.

Why exactly have you selected electrical work as diy hobby/second income?
Are you aware of any of the regulations and know anything about testing, even changing faceplates would require establishing some readings via testing. I would never change a socket plate without measuring the Zs and if a ring the end to end and r1&r2.

If learning from scratch, firstly get your hands dirty with someone with knowledge of the trade. You may find it is not your cuppa tea!
Honestly, I was changing a light fitting a couple of weeks ago and I was genuinely nervous about it, probably because you can't see electricity. It annoyed me, and since I've been looking to get some type of practical trade to help me conduct more professional work on my own house and future properties without outside help (a common reply on the forum is, if you don't know, get a professional ), I thought I'd consider being a spark. On top of that, it's another string to my bow for when I eventually leave my current job.

And the reason you wouldn't change a plug socket without readings is because you're probably an electrician, and I'm not!
 
I know nothing, I can only change the face plates on switches and sockets, and change light fittings. Even then I'm sweating in case I blow up, mains is off for all of it, rather than a particular circuit.
That is really a good example, theory says you should never work on anything live, OK some exceptions for DNO and also testing is not counted as working! and neutral is considered as a live wire, so only way in most domestic premises is to turn off all power, next is HSE say you must isolate elsewhere, isolation using an isolator built into the panel your working on is not good enough, so with domestic in most cases that would mean drawing the DNO fuse. In real life this is not how you do it, you should also protect yourself from ionisation of the atmosphere which yes DNO workers do with huge rubber gloves and the rest of the PPE kit.

In real life we are aware of the dangers and we act in a way to minimise the danger, not wearing nylon for example, but also there are so many pit falls, for example did you know they put graphite in the rubber of wellingtons to stop you getting static build up, so wearing wellingtons does not protect you any better than normal boots.

My son did domestic then after a time he got into industrial, I asked him last week would he return to domestic, he answered no way unless forced. There was a time when domestic electricians were paid by the house for wiring them, and those able to work fast could earn a lot of money, those days are gone. At one time the central heating was the most complex electrical job for domestic electricians, they were considered as the lowest form of electrician, we called them house bashers, those days have also gone, some of the systems used today are getting quite complex. OK as yet the domestic electrician does not carry a laptop as part of his tool kit like the industrial lads, but it is coming, it will not be long before it is part of standard tool kit, it is getting that way now.

The house I am in now has the central heating controlled by the laptop, and even the odd light switch and socket.

When I started maths was only used in collage, once at work you could forget it, today very different, I have sat there working out the relationship between conveyor speed, pouring speed and other variables to put it into a PLC program so the wax poured into a candle in a glass filled the glass but did not touch outside of the glass, boolean logic is all part of the job now, very interesting, once you know it, frighting when the boss is saying "Your an electrician fix it." and you though kernel mapping was looking a woman up and down, even the description is frighting "The kernel trick avoids the explicit mapping that is needed to get linear learning algorithms to learn a nonlinear function or decision boundary. For all and in the input space" OK not so much with domestic, but imagery numbers for example is really easy for some people to get into their heads, others find it really hard, and the whole concept of power factor correction is based on imagery numbers. You can be lucky and work for 50 years and never need it, but the way things are going I would not want to lay money on that.

"A" level maths does not touch them, you need further "A" level maths to learn about them. Yet all part of the electricians formal training. I thought I was good at maths, when I came to do my degree I found out that was far from the case, maths for any engineer is complex, and there is a very fine line between the electrician and electrical engineer, there are still jobs where as an electrician you only need skill, no real knowledge of how things work, I worked as an installation electrician a few times, dressing the cables and not marking the glands were more important then knowing ohms law. How to bend conduit, and how to shape tray where major skills, I was not that good and spent 6 months putting earth rods in and measuring their resistance as they said I had Zero potential.;) As to collage my son decided it would be good to learn the correct way, he had read all about using rollers to bend tray, and thought some day he would get on a job where they did it the correct way, I have only used them once, the results were impressive but the tooling is expensive, so it got to the big day, the teacher said you can get rollers to do this, but we have not got any so we bend it by cutting, at this point my son went mad and demanded his fees returned. And actually got them. Installation is anther world, not even allowed to use a moving spanner, never mind vice grips. And I remember coming across the hawk gland, they were gas tight and it needed skill not to damage the gas seal, my time in Harland and Wolff was a real eye opener. Think it was the last ship built there the Schiehallion.
Schiehallion_oilfield
Schiehallion_oilfield
 

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