Relocating sockets.

[stevef73]

Hi this is my first post although been a keen reader for months. I live in an old cottage with thick stone walls. I am tanking a downstairs room to solve damp problems and insulate. I need to move the existing 2 gang sockets from the walls onto the new plasterboard lining. The existing wiring isn't long enough to bridge the gap from stone wall to plasterboard. Two of the sockets are spurs (single wire into the back of the socket) with the third socket having two sets of wires into it. All the wiring traces up the walls and runs above the ceiling.

How can I extend the wiring to wire the new sockets? Junction Boxes?

Thanks in advance

Steve

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

When you sat two of the sockets are spurs, is the spur taken from the same socket, as this is not as it should be unless a 13a fused connection unit is in place between the socket feeding the spur(s).
If the plasterboard is not yet fixed can you not simply replace the short cable for new and longer cable.

 

[RF Lighting]

And extend the ring to incorporate the new sockets, rather than leaving them as spurs while you are at it.

 

[stevef73]

I'm guessing that the two sockets are spurs - only one cable into the socket. This is existing wiring not something I've put in place myself. I've not followed the wiring into the ceiling but seeing how I'm renovating the room directly above it shouldn't be a problem. I'll lift some boards and see what is going on.

I'm forgetting that the stone wall will be hidden behind the new plasterboard so it shouldn't be a problem to replace the short cable with new longer cable. Would this just be a case of cutting out the old cable and patching in, using a junction boxes, the new longer pieces?

 

[RF Lighting]

No. You want to avoid jointing cables if at all possible.

The best thing to do is trace where the cable goes to (probably another socket), and remove it. Then install a new piece long enough to reach the position of the new socket(s)

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

and if you are extending the ring, you will need to consider the other leg of the circuit.
//www.diynot.com/wiki/electrics:extend_ring

 

[stevef73]

Just had a quick check under the flooring in the room above the downstairs room. It is a ring main circuit upstairs. The room above has sockets in roughly the same position as the room below - one double on three of the four walls. Two of the upstairs double sockets have spurs from them feeding the downstairs double sockets below. One of the downstairs double sockets is on the ring main from the upstairs room.

Due to the thickness of the wall, 700mm in places (two cottages knocked into one) the ring main runs from the CU downstairs up and around the first floor and includes the downstairs rooms as either part of the ring main or as spurs off sockets on the first floor.

I can replace the short spurs with longer cable from the upstairs ring main to the downstairs sockets quite easily. In order to replace the downstairs double socket which is part of the ring main with new cable is going to be tricky. The cable runs a branched route following the ceiling joists and will require lifting half the floor to get to the branch/access points. Can't I use junction boxes to patch in new cable at the point where the cables leave the upstairs and drop down into the room below?

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

regulations require all accessories to be easily accessible, for inspection and testing.
Junction Boxes need to be easily accessible. Is this possible?

 

[RF Lighting]

Could you leave one leg of the ring where it is, or maybe pull a little bit of length on it so it will reach the position on the new plasterboard wall, and then pull the other leg of the ring back through the ceiling, and rop it down at the position of a new socket.

Then install a new link of cable between the two sockets. You could also insert your other sockets in this new link, and do away with those spurs all together.

 

[stevef73]

Access would be under the floorboard next to the wall where the cable drops to the room below. This board is easily lifted as it has access to the central heating pipes too. Does this count as easily accessible?

 

[PrenticeBoyofDerry]

If you make it in to a trap door of some kind and no flooring ie carpet, laminate, tiles etc.. are fitted on to it.

 

[JohnnyG]

I saw these whilst browsing earlier, if they were used would they negate the normal accessibility requirements?
http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ804.html

 

[Chri5]

I saw these whilst browsing earlier, if they were used would they negate the normal accessibility requirements?
http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/ASJ804.html[/QUOTE]

Debated in the past and the consensus was that only crimping or soldering were acceptable.

It goes against the grain of the products primary USP.

I think the general position was that 'just' because a manufacture states a product as maintenance free, doesn't necessarily mean it is so from a BS7671 / IEC point of view.

 

[JohnnyG]

If the OP were to use them in this situation wouldn't the onus be put back on the manufacturer if any non compliant issues were raised?

They seem too good to be true though I'll admit

 

[RF Lighting]

No. It is upto the installer to select accesories which are permitted by BS7671.

For a joint which is NOT going to be accessible for inspection, testing and maintanence, BS7671 permits the following methods of jointing wires:

Regulation 526.3

Every connection shall be accessible for inspection, testing and maintanence, except for the following:

(i) A joint designed to be buried in the ground
(ii) A compound-filled or encapsulated joint
(iii) A connection between a cold tail and the heating element as in ceiling heating, floor heating or a trace heating system
(iv) A joint made by welding, soldering, brazing or appropriate compression tool
(v) A joint forming part of the equipment complying with the appropriate product standard.

Those joint boxes do not fall into any of the categories above, so can not be used.