Sir Patrick Vallance or John the Plumber

[John the plumber]

My apologies, you said it was 86%.
And that that 86% don't have symptoms. I've no idea what asymptotic means.

View attachment 220102
I won't use the obvious description for your blatant denial.

https://www.england.nhs.uk/2020/10/nhs-and-other-professional-bodies-response-to-sunday-times/
Oh dear has it been proven that the media have lied.

 

[ReganAndCarter]

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/569957

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/561995

 

[IT Minion]

Please don't lecture me on test protocol; it's been (part of) my role for over two decades.
By the way, your response is incorrect.

Then how will a false negative be picked up? If I'm wrong I like to know why for the future.

 

[Brigadier]

Then how will a false negative be picked up? If I'm wrong I like to know why for the future.

1. Perform test.
2. (Reanalyse sample).
3. if initial result was negative, but reanalysis shows result to actually be positive, initial result is termed "false negative" (as it was initially falsely declared "negative")

That's the analytical side of false negatives.

False negatives can also come from improper sampling (swab not inserted correctly - you'd hope the hospital wouldn't do that);
- sample handled incorrectly (tube not sealed, swab wrong way up in tube, etc) ;
- reporting positive result as "negative" (typo-type error)

And so on.

 

[IT Minion]

1. Perform test.
2. (Reanalyse sample).
3. if initial result was negative, but reanalysis shows result to actually be positive, initial result is termed "false negative" (as it was initially falsely declared "negative")

That's the analytical side of false negatives.

False negatives can also come from improper sampling (swab not inserted correctly - you'd hope the hospital wouldn't do that);
- sample handled incorrectly (tube not sealed, swab wrong way up in tube, etc) ;
- reporting positive result as "negative" (typo-type error)

And so on.

That's the theory, but ky doesn't address my point, which is that false negatives aren't being looked for routinely so any false negatives that occur will not be picked up.

The labs aren't running samples twice (especially the lighthouse labs, I've heard whispers their quality control is below the ideal). Poor sampling, which is the main cause of false negatives when it has been examined (even in hospitals), won't be picked up by any routine process.

So yes, I fully understand how a false positive can be verified in theory, I don't understand how they might be identified in the real world. My theory is that they're just missed entirely in nearly all cases.

 

[durhamplumber]

To confirm a false negative you need three tests.

Is that right? Surely it is just lowering the chances of an error..not illiminating it to zero?.

 

[IT Minion]

Is that right? Surely it is just lowering the chances of an error..not illiminating it to zero?.

It depends on the reason for the false negative, Brig is focused on testing failure at the lab, I'm focused on sampling failure.

 

[durhamplumber]

It depends on the reason for the false negative, Brig is focused on testing failure at the lab, I'm focused on sampling failure.

Oic...lol...will leave it to you two lads

 

[Brigadier]

It depends on the reason for the false negative, Brig is focused on testing failure at the lab, I'm focused on sampling failure.

No, I told you about sampling failure modes too.

 

[JP_]

Where have i lied?(

Well, you did say there were videos on YouTube of empty covid wards, and you did say there was a hospital with an empty covid ward visible from reception (on the left), and you did also say that "One of the most highly decorated scientists in the world who said that the Covid vaccine was rushed through by Pfizer to make billions due to government panic."

But you refused to share the videos, instead tell us to find them ourselves, and then when all we could find was a BBC news item debunking the story, you dismissed the news story.
You refused to share details of the hospital with an empty ward, on the grounds that you work there - even though you are not sharing anything that is already in the public eye
And you refused to tell us the name of the doctor who said the Pfizer vaccine was just a money making scheme

So, without sharing anything to back up anything you have said, we have to assume that it might not be factually correct ... but you can easily resolve this by backing up your claims.

 

[John the plumber]

Well, you did say there were videos on YouTube of empty covid wards, and you did say there was a hospital with an empty covid ward visible from reception (on the left), and you did also say that "One of the most highly decorated scientists in the world who said that the Covid vaccine was rushed through by Pfizer to make billions due to government panic."

But you refused to share the videos, instead tell us to find them ourselves, and then when all we could find was a BBC news item debunking the story, you dismissed the news story.
You refused to share details of the hospital with an empty ward, on the grounds that you work there - even though you are not sharing anything that is already in the public eye
And you refused to tell us the name of the doctor who said the Pfizer vaccine was just a money making scheme

So, without sharing anything to back up anything you have said, we have to assume that it might not be factually correct ... but you can easily resolve this by backing up your claims.

I have shared multiple videos of empty wards ( one even provided by an nhs nurse)
I also said you walk past the outside of a Covid ward to get to reception ( not like someone lied and tried to say there was one in the foyer when I never said that) you then shared a bbc news story ( the bbc being a media outlet who my original whole point was that the media are lying)
Of course the media are going to debunk it. ( does that mean just because the bbc release a story then it must be true)
Regarding the hospital I said I had a contract there so I’m not going to share that kind of information thus potentially putting a contract in jeopardy.
When did I say anything regarding a specific doctor saying about a money making scheme.
You are clearly not quite reading everything as I have said MULTIPLE times and I will say YET AGAIN that I have provided videos regarding empty wards,I have also provided details ( from the NHS) regarding what you lot have said almost laughingly that ventilators can’t be moved,only the face mask part.
I don’t know how simpler I could put it.
I have backed up my claims multiple times. You keep saying I have not backed it up. It’s there in the forums.the videos,the nhs statements everything.
Every time you have made a claim I have proven you wrong and when I do you change the subject or never talk about it again lol.

 

[JP_]

When did I say anything regarding a specific doctor saying about a money making scheme.

You said it here: https://www.diynot.com/diy/threads/johnson-is-so-useless.562175/page-15#post-4852225

You did not share any video of an empty covid ward, at least not on the "Johnson Is So Useless" thread. Care to share here?

You have not backed up anything - repeating it is not backing it up.
If you say there are videos on Youtube, paste the Youtube link here.

 

[John the plumber]

You said it here: https://www.diynot.com/diy/threads/johnson-is-so-useless.562175/page-15#post-4852225

You did not share any video of an empty covid ward, at least not on the "Johnson Is So Useless" thread. Care to share here?

You have not backed up anything - repeating it is not backing it up.
If you say there are videos on Youtube, paste the Youtube link here.

On Page 19 of the Johnson is useless is 7 videos of empty hospitals.
They are there for all to see but yet again when I’ve proved you wrong you change the subject or lie.
Your making yourself look a fool
But I guess now you are going to say there is no other people needing any other treatment except for Covid. For probably the 6th or 7th time now you have tried to twist my words. I said multiple time that the hospitals are not packed like the media claims. If they where then there wouldn’t be any empty wards what so ever .I stated that and got that absolutely comical response from you lot that the ventilators can’t be moved which is why they can’t use the other wards.
Yet low and behold I proved that also.

 

[Trazor]

On Page 19 of the Johnson is useless is 7 videos of empty hospitals.
They are there for all to see but yet again when I’ve proved you wrong you change the subject or lie.
Your making yourself look a fool
But I guess now you are going to say there is no other people needing any other treatment except for Covid. For probably the 6th or 7th time now you have tried to twist my words. I said multiple time that the hospitals are not packed like the media claims. If they where then there wouldn’t be any empty wards what so ever .I stated that and got that absolutely comical response from you lot that the ventilators can’t be moved which is why they can’t use the other wards.
Yet low and behold I proved that also.

You have only proved, that either you are a Troll, or you lack any understanding of what is really happening in Hospitals.

Your videos were recreated, on the news this morning, to show how easy it is to fake a "Hospitals empty video"

 

[John the plumber]

You have only proved, that either you are a Troll, or you lack any understanding of what is really happening in Hospitals.

Your videos were recreated, on the news this morning, to show how easy it is to fake a "Hospitals empty video"

I am not a troll and the only one lacking understanding is you. I find it quite worrying that people like you choose to believe everything the media tell you.
Was it recreated in the news this morning that ventilators aren’t mobile as was said by you lot,what about the vaccine that they said won’t stop Covid yet you all think once you have the vaccine it will all be ok. You are not getting what I’m saying are you
My point is THE MEDIA ARE LYING ABOUT TO THE PUBLIC REGARDING ASPECTS OF COVID
The figures of deaths are nowhere near what is being reported. Just a few days ago the us chat show host Larry king died.
The headlines from the media are Larry king dies from Covid.
Larry king had cancer and other illnesses which caused his death.
But they say he caught Covid before he died.
Covid wasn’t the cause of his death but that’s what the media report.
If someone is told they have a week to live and a few hours or days before death they break there arm ,that broken arm isn’t the cause of death is it. They just happen to break their arm around the time of there inevitable death.
They said the same about the Yorkshire ripper. That he died of Covid.
He had a multitude of life threatening illnesses which led to his death. He was admitted to hospital with death immanent. But the media put his cause of death down to Covid.
The media have been sued multiple times for inaccurate stories.
The media in courts of law have been proven to have lied about things.
Yet you choose to believe a proven lier.
I feel sorry for you.