Tory party urges activists to campaign like Trump by ‘weaponising fake news’ and ‘fighting wokeism’

[fillyboy]

Biden however is a statesmen, a seasoned politician who understands foreign policy and has many friends around the world

and the end of Trump will weaken the Tory populism...what a shame

And he's quite rightly being advised to follow trumps foreign policy, closely. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

 

[Notch7]

And he's quite rightly being advised to follow trumps foreign policy, closely. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

That's impossible.

Trump had no foreign policy

 

[SirGalahad]

i'm in agreement, BUT who is out there willing to make this change? it's not the current crop of politicians whether it be labour or lib dems etc, the green party is full of loonies....

the future's not looking particuarly bright either, with extreme leftists and woke aplologists leaving school and uni's

the future is not looking very good.

Wherever people stand on the poltical spectrum, to have any sort of debate we need to agree on a set of truths or facts. But if every fact is disputed or people bring their own facts then yes it looks bleak.

Case in point.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...icised-over-using-fake-city-hall-coat-of-arms

We can disagree to the level of Government intervention and policies but the basis of that has to be an agreement of what is true or is factual.

 

[sxturbo]

Wherever people stand on the poltical spectrum, to have any sort of debate we need to agree on a set of truths or facts. But if every fact is disputed or people bring their own facts then yes it looks bleak.

Case in point.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...icised-over-using-fake-city-hall-coat-of-arms

We can disagree to the level of Government intervention and policies but the basis of that has to be an agreement of what is true or is factual.

i'm in agreement with you, the constant spout of bull poop and he said she said has got undeniably tiring.

i genuinely think politics is currently at it's lowest poitn, but with still plenty of further scope to bring it down further.

why we cant just have something thats common sense, factual and centre (not left or right) i dont know. it's also not all the publics fault, as they have to vote for who is put forward to them. hence why we've ended up with boris.

 

[SirGalahad]

i'm in agreement with you, the constant spout of bull poop and he said she said has got undeniably tiring.

i genuinely think politics is currently at it's lowest poitn, but with still plenty of further scope to bring it down further.

why we cant just have something thats common sense, factual and centre (not left or right) i dont know. it's also not all the publics fault, as they have to vote for who is put forward to them. hence why we've ended up with boris.

Bojo or Corbyn. Choose your poison.

Politics is about one thing and that's winning. You win not by winning with better arguments but by making sure your side votes and the other does not. Gerrymandering, voter suppression and pork barrel politics is as you pointed out not of the publics creation.

I think most people would agree that they want is strong public services within a capitalist and enterprise system that is aspirational. These are not hard to achieve.

We need a better conversation on taxation.

 

[Notch7]

These are not hard to achieve.

they are impossible to achieve...... all the time politicians are allowed conflicts of interest; ie rich people buying political policy.

Here's a classic example:

Matt Hancock got paid £32k from the institute of economic affairs
the IEA is a pressure group for privatising the NHS (its funded by US libertarian groups)

one has to ask does Matt Hancock care about the NHS when he issues loads of NHS contracts up for private purchase.....or does he care about his bank balance?

 

[durhamplumber]

....or does he care about his bank balance?

Are you getting up at 5am and setting up software for a laff then?

 

[sxturbo]

Are you getting up at 5am and setting up software for a laff then?

i think notch's point is that politicians care more for their own and their friends personal short term gain than they do about the country they are supposed to be working for.

all politicians once they get into power, they know they've got 5 years to milk it for what it's worth, they know the chances of them staying there for the next 5 years is very slim.

Has anyone ever seen a poor politician? (well i suppose you wouldnt when there basic is just shy of £80k + expenses.) but the majority of them leave office much better off than when they started... any guesses as to how?

 

[SirGalahad]

i think notch's point is that politicians care more for their own and their friends personal short term gain than they do about the country they are supposed to be working for.

all politicians once they get into power, they know they've got 5 years to milk it for what it's worth, they know the chances of them staying there for the next 5 years is very slim.

Has anyone ever seen a poor politician? (well i suppose you wouldnt when there basic is just shy of £80k + expenses.) but the majority of them leave office much better off than when they started... any guesses as to how?

Actually if you are in a safe seat you can milk it for decades - which gets back to the fptp system isn't working.

Father of the house was elected in 1975!!!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_Kingdom_MPs_by_seniority_(2019–present)

 

[durhamplumber]

i think notch's point

Indeed.

 

[durhamplumber]

Has anyone ever seen a poor politician?

Never seen a poor builder..or surgeon.or accountant.or doctor.or F1 driver.

i think notch's point is that politicians care more for their own and their friends personal short term gain than they do about the country they are supposed to be working for.

all politicians once they get into power, they know they've got 5 years to milk it for what it's worth, they know the chances of them staying there for the next 5 years is very slim.

Has anyone ever seen a poor politician? (well i suppose you wouldnt when there basic is just shy of £80k + expenses.) but the majority of them leave office much better off than when they started... any guesses as to how?

I know precisely what Notchys point is...all he goes onabout.Thinks every Tory is corrupt and Dopy Corbyn is some sort of Arc Angel.

 

[Brigadier]

Take money out of politics.

Taking money out politics isn't as easy as it sounds but they could start by banning private donations to political parties.
Used to be that MPs were privately funded and that led to enormous corruption, MPs are now funded by the state so it follows that their parties should be state funded as well.
The main parties should be allocated a set amount to pay for their election expenses.
Taking private donations from vested interests should be banned.

Yes. The less money and favours sloshing around is a good enough place to start.

they are impossible to achieve...... all the time politicians are allowed conflicts of interest; ie rich people buying political policy.

Here's a classic example:

Matt Hancock got paid £32k from the institute of economic affairs
the IEA is a pressure group for privatising the NHS (its funded by US libertarian groups)

one has to ask does Matt Hancock care about the NHS when he issues loads of NHS contracts up for private purchase.....or does he care about his bank balance?

I posted this before, but can't find it.....

Pay MP s silly money, like £5M p. a.
It'll cost a lot more to "buy" one, it'll make it less tempting for all but the most avaricious, and it might make the electorate take a bit of notice of what they're actually achieving.
After all, it seems to work for show - pony footballers, in that the two things levelled at many of them are :

"He's shoite! I wouldn't pay him in washers!", and
"He's on £100k a week !"

 

[Notch7]

Are you getting up at 5am and setting up software for a laff then?

No I'm trying to help a very disorganised business turn itself into a professional company with proper processes and admin.

I enjoy the challenge of problem solving...and I'm getting paid for it.

 

[Notch7]

Thinks every Tory is corrupt

That's not true....but this Tory government are entirely motivated by self interest......worst govt by far in my life time.

If you can't see that it's because you are seeing everything through Brexit goggles.

Brexit is an opportunity to avoid scrutiny.....look at people like Steve Baker, Owen Paterson etc etc.....noses in the trough.

 

[Brigadier]

......worst govt by far in my life time.

..... that you are aware of / care about.


Do you not think most other governments "in your life" have rinsed the working man?
Crucial differences this time :
- they're **** at hiding it
- even if they weren't **** at hiding it, scrutiny (via the Internet sleuths) is far more intrusive, perceptive, and widespread than ever before
- they're brazenly not bothered that it's not hidden
- you're more bothered now than ever before
- you're spot - welding your pants, because of your new - found ideology.