Whats stopped you voting Labour

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It's our fault for insisting that the holy grail that is the NHS is free at the point of delivery. It's not sustainable. Even in countries where the healthcare is insurance funded, France for example, they are struggling. Germany less so but I believe the insurance premiums are significantly higher than France.
Get it properly managed and get rid of the no accountability regards money wasted get rid of the countless managers doing next to nothing and there is more than enough money in it at present
 
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Labour should bring back David milliband, he was at least bright and engaging. A good front man, but they have systemic issues in the party which I don't see them fixing any time soon.

I'm of the opinion that there's barely a handful of decent MPs the rest are a waste of space.

Our local council recently changed from Tory to lib dem and all they've done is blather about how awful the previous administration were instead of doing anything about it. They seem either incapable or in shock but it's likely both.
 
there is more than enough money in it at present
Nonsense

That's just a feeble excuse putting the blame in a government that couldn't run a whelk stall and has turned the NHS into a dispirited permanent crisis

An excuse used by people who think that insufficient resources can give good results
 
It's our fault for insisting that the holy grail that is the NHS is free at the point of delivery. It's not sustainable. Even in countries where the healthcare is insurance funded, France for example, they are struggling. Germany less so but I believe the insurance premiums are significantly higher than France.
so a government issue then ?
 
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Get it properly managed and get rid of the no accountability regards money wasted get rid of the countless managers doing next to nothing and there is more than enough money in it at present
A management issue then

Who is in control of that ?
 
It's our fault for insisting that the holy grail that is the NHS is free at the point of delivery. It's not sustainable. Even in countries where the healthcare is insurance funded, France for example, they are struggling. Germany less so but I believe the insurance premiums are significantly higher than France.
I'm not sure I agree with that. Decisions have been made over years/decades that are now coming back to bite us on the bum. There used to be cottage hospitals peppered across the country, ideal for helping pick up the slack. Closed. We used to have more hospitals beds. Numbers reduced in the interests of efficiency. The issue with running a service so lean is when usage of said service ramps up, it can't cope. Of course the NHS needs managers and an administrative system, however there is no doubt it has once again become bloated in this area. Instead of exploiting existing human resource, the NHS is infamous for concluding 'we need to create a new post for that' instead of using existing managers and admin staff more creatively.

I'd be very careful in desiring a move away from the free at point of care model. Knowing this country, what we'd end up with would be FAR from ideal for the masses ...
 
Nonsense

That's just a feeble excuse putting the blame in a government that couldn't run a whelk stall and has turned the NHS into a dispirited permanent crisis
So your agreeing that it is run badly regardless who is to blame glad we cleared that up
 
I'm not sure I agree with that. Decisions have been made over years/decades that are now coming back to bite us on the bum. There used to be cottage hospitals peppered across the country, ideal for helping pick up the slack. Closed. We used to have more hospitals beds. Numbers reduced in the interests of efficiency. The issue with running a service so lean is when usage of said service ramps up, it can't cope. Of course the NHS needs managers and an administrative system, however there is no doubt it has once again become bloated in this area. Instead of exploiting existing human resource, the NHS is infamous for concluding 'we need to create a new post for that' instead of using existing managers and admin staff more creatively.

Agreed, less hospitals, less beds, yet there is an ever increasing number of staff and an ever increasing budget, doesn't make sense does it.
I'd be very careful in desiring a move away from the free at point of care model. Knowing this country, what we'd end up with would be FAR from ideal for the masses ...

Ten or twenty quid for a visit to a GP sounds reasonable, it would certainly reduce GP's workload at a stroke just by getting rid of the time wasters and the ones who wont show up anyway.
I believe in France the insurance premium is about 5% of salary, possibly 7% in Germany, unlike the US, the insurance companies are not for profit organisations although still private companies as opposed to Govt run.
 
Following on from my post a few mins ago, here's just one example, now imagine scaling this scenario up across the UK. I know someone who works in the NHS in an administrative role. They earn ~£40k pa. In the department within which they work, the management identified a requirement for someone with an additional skillset. The person I know already dabbled in this area as part of their role and suggested to the management 'can I not receive some additional training and absorb the additional task?' In short the management decided 'no' and employed another person on ~£40k pa. I have no reason to disbelieve him, the person I know is adamant they could have absorbed what this entirely new role is doing.

This happens time and time again and I don't doubt local councils are the same. Of course there will be times when an additional member of the team 'is' required, no one would deny that. However I've heard of more than a few real life scenarios as per the above.
 
Get it properly managed and get rid of the no accountability regards money wasted get rid of the countless managers doing next to nothing and there is more than enough money in it at present

I've seen so much money with my time in Hospital
 
Starrmer is in the stadium after the marathon, just one more lap but it’s his to lose. He is a blairite , aping tory policies and trying to win back the northern wall seats, which he will do, farrage wont put up any candidates unless he wants to help Starrmer. Many people who voted tory wont vote, so turnout will be down.

The ratchet effect of the country moving to the political right will be continued. The perfectly sensible re nationalisation of the railways will be quietly dropped.

As an illustration of nige’s position, he was asked recently as an arsenal fan, would he sit next to corbin or peers moregan at a game, and said moregan without hesitation.

Blup
 
Following on from my post a few mins ago, here's just one example, now imagine scaling this scenario up across the UK. I know someone who works in the NHS in an administrative role. They earn ~£40k pa. In the department within which they work, the management identified a requirement for someone with an additional skillset. The person I know already dabbled in this area as part of their role and suggested to the management 'can I not receive some additional training and absorb the additional task?' In short the management decided 'no' and employed another person on ~£40k pa. I have no reason to disbelieve him, the person I know is adamant they could have absorbed what this entirely new role is doing.

This happens time and time again and I don't doubt local councils are the same. Of course there will be times when an additional member of the team 'is' required, no one would deny that. However I've heard of more than a few real life scenarios as per the above.
Exactly what's happening. The person doing the recruiting can then justify a bigger salary for themselves if they're in charge of more people.

The NHS is currently receiving vastly more money than at any time in its history, even allowing for inflation. The Labour party are telling outright lies in stating that it's short of money. The entire system is a massive money-siphoning scam that's swallowing a vast chunk of the country's money. The last time I looked at the figures I believe it is costing just under £8000 per household per year.

We need to get start getting angry at the NHS itself, not just at the people who write the cheques. The people within it make use of its semi-holy status, in that anyone criticising its greatness is caricatured as wanting their granny dead. Check the cars in the staff car park of any NHS establishment to see where the money's really going.
 
Following on from my post a few mins ago, here's just one example, now imagine scaling this scenario up across the UK. I know someone who works in the NHS in an administrative role. They earn ~£40k pa. In the department within which they work, the management identified a requirement for someone with an additional skillset. The person I know already dabbled in this area as part of their role and suggested to the management 'can I not receive some additional training and absorb the additional task?' In short the management decided 'no' and employed another person on ~£40k pa. I have no reason to disbelieve him, the person I know is adamant they could have absorbed what this entirely new role is doing.

This happens time and time again and I don't doubt local councils are the same. Of course there will be times when an additional member of the team 'is' required, no one would deny that. However I've heard of more than a few real life scenarios as per the above.
Mrs Mottie has 4 managers above her in the NHS. If boss number one wants to ask Mrs Mottie a question, she asks boss number 2 who asks boss number 3 who asks boss number 4 who asks Mrs Mottie. The answer is relayed back in reverse order. That’s when they are all there of course. They seem to have a lot of sickness between them and it’s rare that they are all at work at the same time.
 
Mrs Mottie has 4 managers above her in the NHS. If boss number one wants to ask Mrs Mottie a question, she asks boss number 2 who asks boss number 3 who asks boss number 4 who asks Mrs Mottie. The answer is relayed back in reverse order. That’s when they are all there of course. They seem to have a lot of sickness between them and it’s rare that they are all at work at the same time.
local council. Head of housing phones my mate head of repairs and say they need a telephone conference with 3 other managers to ask my mates assistant if she will do overtime to help with a project .
Mate puts phone down asks his assistant if she will do overtime to help out she says no
Mate phones head of housing back says no need for meeting as she is not going to do it .
Mate got put on a disciplinary for not following orders with hours of time wasted and guy brought in for hearing bursting out laughing and throwing it out straight away
 
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