Yaxley-Lennon supporter to be prosecuted

[sodthisforfun]

Do you honestly and seriously believe that racism is caused by a fear of the unknown, a fear of outsiders?
That racism is a natural ideology that we are born with as a defensive mechanism? Therefore, we need to be taught not to be racist to overcome our natural instinct?
That racism serves us well?

I didn't say racism served us well, don't be disgusting.

Racism is fear and ignorance.
We are inbuilt with a fear of the unknown.
The two are NOT completely separate.

Parent's don't, on a whole, sit down and teach little kiddies to be racist. There is far FAR more to it. Yes, we do need to teach people not to be racist, prejudice or whatever. We need to overcome that because although racism is learned in various subtle ways (like bringing up children only with your peers), everyone has an inbuilt inclination towards learning to fear other people who are different to us. This, as well as ignorance are part of why racism thrives so easily when it shouldn't, especially in this day and age. Don't forget that racism occurs over the whole world, people of all skin colours and backgrounds. It's not a white problem only.

 

[HawkEye244]

You only need look as far as one of his gormless disciples - Hawkeye.

Even if I was the only one here I would still stand up to left wing extremists like you.

 

[noseall]

Even if I was the only one here

You need to fill.oit your days somehow. Extremist - lol.

 

[Doppleganger]

I didn't say racism served us well,

You did say that:

Fear of the unknown is inbuilt. ... it's a survival mechanism and has served humankind well.

You have now also said:

Racism is fear and ignorance.
We are inbuilt with a fear of the unknown.
The two are NOT completely separate.

Therefore it is only natural that one conflates your two statements.

However, I do disagree with your definition of racism and so do many other far more eminent people than I.
"Racism refers to a variety of practices, beliefs, social relations, and phenomena that work to reproduce a racial hierarchy and social structure that yield superiority, power, and privilege for some, and discrimination and oppression for others." Nicki Lisa Cole, Ph.D. https://www.thoughtco.com/racism-definition-3026511

If your definition of racism is incorrect your whole argument is based on an incorrect belief.

Parent's don't, on a whole, sit down and teach little kiddies to be racist. There is far FAR more to it.

Agreed and I have already said so. Parents do not consciously teach their children to be racist or prejudiced in any way. But the children do learn their behaviour from the role models of their parents and peers.

Yes, we do need to teach people not to be racist, prejudice or whatever.

No. We need to stop presenting them with examples of prejudice for them to learn.
If they are prejudiced then we do need to teach them not to be. But it is a case of teaching them that their original learning was morally wrong.
Going back to the original topic, if the child's behaviour was a natural instinctive reaction driven by a fear of the unknown, surely he should not be punished for it?

We need to overcome that because although racism is learned in various subtle ways (like bringing up children only with your peers), everyone has an inbuilt inclination towards learning to fear other people who are different to us. This, as well as ignorance are part of why racism thrives so easily when it shouldn't, especially in this day and age. Don't forget that racism occurs over the whole world, people of all skin colours and backgrounds. It's not a white problem only.

No. Some cultures revere strange new visitors while other cultures revile them.
Racism and prejudice is a cultural problem. It is taught by society to young minds that soak up societal practices.


Fear of the unknown is not a natural phenomenon. Otherwise young children would not persistently pick up strange objects for close inspection. They would not be drawn to new and strange places. They would not want to 'go exploring'.
But I think this avenue is irrelevant anyway, because racism is not 'fear of the unknown'.

 

[Notch7]

No. We need to stop presenting them with examples of prejudice for them to learn

But that is the same point as this:

Yes, we do need to teach people not to be racist, prejudice or whatever

So you are arguing against yourself. Doesnt it give you a headache?

 

[sodthisforfun]

You did say that:

You have now also said:

Therefore it is only natural that one conflates your two statements.

However, I do disagree with your definition of racism and so do many other far more eminent people than I.
"Racism refers to a variety of practices, beliefs, social relations, and phenomena that work to reproduce a racial hierarchy and social structure that yield superiority, power, and privilege for some, and discrimination and oppression for others." Nicki Lisa Cole, Ph.D. https://www.thoughtco.com/racism-definition-3026511

If your definition of racism is incorrect your whole argument is based on an incorrect belief.




Agreed and I have already said so. Parents do not consciously teach their children to be racist or prejudiced in any way. But the children do learn their behaviour from the role models of their parents and peers.


No. We need to stop presenting them with examples of prejudice for them to learn.
If they are prejudiced then we do need to teach them not to be. But it is a case of teaching them that their original learning was morally wrong.
Going back to the original topic, if the child's behaviour was a natural instinctive reaction driven by a fear of the unknown, surely he should not be punished for it?


No. Some cultures revere strange new visitors while other cultures revile them.
Racism and prejudice is a cultural problem. It is taught by society to young minds that soak up societal practices.


Fear of the unknown is not a natural phenomenon. Otherwise young children would not persistently pick up strange objects for close inspection. They would not be drawn to new and strange places. They would not want to 'go exploring'.
But I think this avenue is irrelevant anyway, because racism is not 'fear of the unknown'.

Go do some reading.

 

[sodthisforfun]

But that is the same point as this:



So you are arguing against yourself. Doesnt it give you a headache?

Exactly what I thought. Tried to prove a point by...er... saying what I already said.

 

[Doppleganger]

But that is the same point as this:



So you are arguing against yourself. Doesnt it give you a headache?

If you think that an absence of poor behaviour is the same as the teaching of proper behaviour, ........

Let's take a simple example:
You go on one site and many are not wearing their PPE, you naturally adopt the prevailing behaviour especially if you are learning that cultural behaviour.
You go on a different site and everyone is wearing their PPE but you persist in your learned behaviour of not wearing PPE. You need to be re-educated. It is not a case of passively presenting good examples. It is a case of actively correcting bad behaviour.

In the first example, you have learned bad habits. You haven't been taught them you've just copied the examples. You now need to be re-educated in correct behaviour.

Had you started on the site where everyone wore their PPE, you would naturally adopt that behaviour.

 

[Notch7]

f you think that an absence of poor behaviour is the same as the teaching of proper behaviour, ......

Ah bless, you havent heard of teaching by example.

 

[Doppleganger]

Ah bless, you havent heard of teaching by example.

Precisely. When bad habits or poor behaviour are the examples, which you adopt, you need to be re-educated.
The former is passive examples, the latter is active education.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

Parents do not consciously teach their children to be racist or prejudiced in any way.

I think we can guarantee that some do.

 

[Doppleganger]

I think we can guarantee that some do.

I'm not sure I agree. It is like suggesting that parents consciously teach their children to use corporal punishment.
I'm not confident that that is accurate. I would rather believe that parents are unaware of their poor behaviour or examples.

Although I would agree that some may take perverted pleasure in their children following in their examples.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

I would be amazed to find that not one of the extremist violent nutters in the EDL/BNP/NF/NA has ever explicitly espoused their ideology to their children.

 

[Notch7]

Precisely. When bad habits or poor behaviour are the examples, which you adopt, you need to be re-educated.
The former is passive examples, the latter is active education.

Precisely: proves you are arguing against yourself.

Thank you for agreeing with me, sometimes you do see sense

 

[Notch7]

the latter is active education

Thats your words, so youve adjusted what was said to weakly prove your point.