24 Dec - update - Grundfos pump still runs constantly

[shambolic]

How hard is it to wire an S plan ffs?
Neutrals together, earths together, greys together into permanent live, oranges together feeding pump and boiler and room stat feeding brown on heating valve and cylinder stat feeding brown on hot water valve.
It’s a doddle.

 

[Gasguru]

I suspect none of the BG are given the time to tear the wiring apart and check it thoroughly...preferring to waste more time with quick "fixes".
I still wonder if an earths missing and the boiler switched live that sits there floating is picking up sufficient voltage to trigger a demand. The equivalent Glowworm HXi has no filtering on the input to the opto-isolator..not sure what happens on the Vaillant pcbs.

 

[picasso]

I still reckon the brown and greys are joined, each valve will work correctly until both valves are switched then one of the valves will latch feed from the orange back down the grey/brown holding the valve open.

 

[dilalio]

Started off with a Honeywell and a drayton.

Drayton/honeywell... I've lost the plot... I think the grid substation needs changing

 

[system]

I suspect none of the BG are given the time to tear the wiring apart and check it thoroughly...preferring to waste more time with quick "fixes".
I still wonder if an earths missing and the boiler switched live that sits there floating is picking up sufficient voltage to trigger a demand. The equivalent Glowworm HXi has no filtering on the input to the opto-isolator..not sure what happens on the Vaillant pcbs.

While it is certainly possible to induced effects like you suggest, I do think that the sensitivity of digital meters can mislead sometimes and show up odd readings when looking at unconnected wires running next to mains wires in the same cable. A good old fashioned AVO would never fall for that LOL

 

[GasElectricalRepairs]

The pumps isnt one of the faulty batch , but 11 years old.
If the wiring is correct on this why are valve actuators being replaced and if damaged why? If it runs for a few days before failing , I can't see how it's wired incorrectly.

If a wire has a nail through it you could get something like this or rodent damage.

Its had to say without all the facts.

If the fuse isn't 3 amp and the pump is drawing too much current it still could be doing these contacts in.

Just can't see it being wired wrong if its worked ok before and no one has messed with it.

 

[Littlemiss21]

The pumps isnt one of the faulty batch , but 11 years old.
If the wiring is correct on this why are valve actuators being replaced and if damaged why? If it runs for a few days before failing , I can't see how it's wired incorrectly.

If a wire has a nail through it you could get something like this or rodent damage.

Its had to say without all the facts.

If the fuse isn't 3 amp and the pump is drawing too much current it still could be doing these contacts in.

Just can't see it being wired wrong if its worked ok before and no one has messed with it.

The fuse is the fuse spur is def 3 amp. Nobody touched the wires/junction box until the first time we had this problem on 31 October. The heating valve was changed and everything ran fine until 21 November until the same pump running constantly issue started.

 

[Ihavenojob]

Is the wiring centre a Honeywell one with a pcb & links you have to cut for S or Y plan ? Had one this year blowing fuses randomly, would be ok for a few days, then pop the fuse. If you do have one maybe its shorting to the orange somehow?

 

[breadnbutter]

is the house wiring correct polarity. is the wiring to the fused spur correct polarity.

 

[breadnbutter]

Is the wiring centre a Honeywell one with a pcb & links you have to cut for S or Y plan ? Had one this year blowing fuses randomly, would be ok for a few days, then pop the fuse. If you do have one maybe its shorting to the orange somehow?

oh yeh if its a Honeywell pcb wire center, then I would definitely be suspecting that, surely they can find the fault with a multimeter.

 

[Gasguru]

Really BG should be calling in an electrician who can easily do 500v insulation testing on the cables to rule out intermittent shorts and earth impedance tests.

 

[GasElectricalRepairs]

1.Have you had any work done around the time the fault started . Ie chance of a nail through a wire or drilling near a wire.
2. Were the zones valves changed because the contacts had become fused shut.
3. What is the voltage sat on the orange wire from WC when no call for Heat or HW.
4. Is this only effecting the pump , ie does the boiler fire at the same time as pump running constantly.
5. Have only the valve heads been changed ?
6. If the valve body is the same one throughout the fault , could this be sticking.
7. Has the circuit to the faulty valve been isolated and cables tested for continuity and insulation resistance.

 

[dilalio]

FFS... Change the pump and proceed from there... It's the most commonly changed component and BG must have at least 2 on board each van. Without being there, I can't think of anything else before doing a complete rewire.

 

[Littlemiss21]

1.Have you had any work done around the time the fault started . Ie chance of a nail through a wire or drilling near a wire.
2. Were the zones valves changed because the contacts had become fused shut.
3. What is the voltage sat on the orange wire from WC when no call for Heat or HW.
4. Is this only effecting the pump , ie does the boiler fire at the same time as pump running constantly.
5. Have only the valve heads been changed ?
6. If the valve body is the same one throughout the fault , could this be sticking.
7. Has the circuit to the faulty valve been isolated and cables tested for continuity and insulation resistance.

Good morning
1. No work done at all - nothing.
2. The zone valves were changed as it was assumed they had 'sticky micro switches' - the last engineer actually looked inside the actuator and the micro switches weren't fused shut or 'fried'.
3. When the fault was present, there was 240v in the orange wire - no call for heat or HW - even changing the programmer /timer to off did not stop the pump from running.
4. The pump runs constantly and the boiler fires up too.
5. The whole actuators have been changed - including the brass valve on the pipes
6. The 'live feed' is always on the heating valve side - it only happens once the heating has been on. The room thermostat is satisfied, stops the demand for head, the valve shuts so the radiators cool down, but the pump keeps going circulating the water around the pipe work in the airing cupboard,firing the boiler up.
7. The cables were checked using a multimeter yesterday, but no stray voltage anywhere ?

Apologies if I'm not thorough enough in my details, make up and pretty clothes are my forte, so this is all new to me. But, I'm fast on my way to becoming a heating apprentice

 

[Littlemiss21]

FFS... Change the pump and proceed from there... It's the most commonly changed component and BG must have at least 2 on board each van. Without being there, I can't think of anything else before doing a complete rewire.

Hi and thank you. Am I correct in thinking that the Grundfos pump only needs small voltage and will keep running? It might as well be changed, as nothing else left to be changed now.