carpenters must be rich

[gasmarc]

Looking back on the things I use to do traveling miles in the evenings just to give a quote to build wardrobes , I would work my nuts off for £80 upwards per day. I remember doing a few jobs for a local bed store where they wanted a load of shelves put on the walls to hang headboards on also a door blocked off and something else doing , Well I knocked the lot out in the day , we are talking Yankee days and the customer was going mental saying his staff had to work a 6 day week to get that type of money, From memory it was £150 or the like. I think a person should charge whatever they are happy with and their customers are willing to pay. There are so many cowboys in the building trade it is beyond belief. Personally I would not leave 9k worth of tool in anything french, there is a guy on u tube that does the mobile work shop superb, God I cringe at the amount of tools required not to mention the mess shooting in a few door and the furniture, I remember myself and a mate went to price up a job for an Indian account who was having an extention done and he wanted us to make 2 pairs of french doors out of 4 normal size doors and hang them fooking idiot, I decided to give up the game after lugging an 8x4 18 mm mdf sheet up 4 floors only to get the sheet caught in the stair well

 

[HERTS P&D]

I worked for a customer last week who sat there watching me while I done some pipework. Once I finished he said 'that was easy' I said 'Iv'e been doing it 27 years.'

Some people

Andy

 

[stevethejoiner]

I worked for a customer last week who sat there watching me while I done some pipework. Once I finished he said 'that was easy' I said 'Iv'e been doing it 27 years.'

Some people

Andy

Andy, I think we make it look too easy sometimes. Good tools and equipment, portable power tools for me, pipe freezing etc for you speeds up the work so we spend less time on the job. But it should not mean we charge less because it was quicker. And when we do struggle it can give the opposite effect and make us look idiots. No easy answer to satisfying a customer that a job is value for money. I could service my car, but rarely do, my garage does it quicker, they have the tools and knowledge so I let them do it even if I don't like paying 3 times my hourly rate.

 

[TonyW2]

Good tools and equipment, portable power tools for me, pipe freezing etc for you speeds up the work so we spend less time on the job. But it should not mean we charge less because it was quicker. And when we do struggle it can give the opposite effect and make us look idiots.I could service my car, but rarely do, my garage does it quicker, they have the tools and knowledge so I let them do it even if I don't like paying 3 times my hourly rate.

Once any increased capital and operational costs of the good new tools have been factored in to the costing, then the resulting time saving should be partly passed on to the customer, or else a competitor willing to work at the equivalent of your original hourly rate will do so. ( Market forces===think of the old newspaper industry and the Luddites ! )

If the garage charges 3x the cost but you could DIY the work in less than 3 times the time, would not you be better off doing it---and also enjoying a change of activity? Thats before even considering that the garage service costs of the car (not a working van) come out of after tax income.

 

[stevethejoiner]

Good tools and equipment, portable power tools for me, pipe freezing etc for you speeds up the work so we spend less time on the job. But it should not mean we charge less because it was quicker. And when we do struggle it can give the opposite effect and make us look idiots.I could service my car, but rarely do, my garage does it quicker, they have the tools and knowledge so I let them do it even if I don't like paying 3 times my hourly rate.

Once any increased capital and operational costs of the good new tools have been factored in to the costing, then the resulting time saving should be partly passed on to the customer, or else a competitor willing to work at the equivalent of your original hourly rate will do so. ( Market forces===think of the old newspaper industry and the Luddites ! )

If the garage charges 3x the cost but you could DIY the work in less than 3 times the time, would not you be better off doing it---and also enjoying a change of activity? Thats before even considering that the garage service costs of the car (not a working van) come out of after tax income.[/quote]

Words of wisdom from an old beekeeper who lives near to me who has been accused of selling his honey at over the top prices than other beekeepers. When told his price is too high he answers "if at the end of the year I have honey left then yes my prices are too high, but I always sell all that I produce so my prices can't be too high"

I have plenty of work so will not be pressured into competing with cowboys. If my work load dropped then maybe I would reduce my rates but until then, customers pay what I ask or go somewhere else.
And because I have plenty of work means I don't have to get my hands greasy servicing my car when I could be doing other things.

 

[TonyW2]

That's fair enough --if the market supports your charges then that's the price to charge.
Just shows that there are plenty of customers around with excess cash, despite any recession and insufficient tradesmen in need of work.

 

[chapeau]

My joiner charges £80 to hang a door if it's all he's going to do, £40 if he's round doing something else at the same time.

Pays to shop around though at that price not worth my time.

 

[SAMRANHAM]

I've just priced a job for a builder at £1500 plus the Tav. (an old traveller friend used to add Tav and call it Travellers added value if questioned, but never paid it over to the Revenue!).

Anyway i digress..The Builder came back to me and said it was double his estimate, and he'll do it himself! We'll i suppose we must be Millionaires or either good at estimating the correct amount of time to do the job.

I'd like to see the Builders carpentry skills!

Market forces will partially set the rate, but we also need to remember that the COST OF LIVING should also be reflected in the cost of a days work, not how much we can undercut the other guy.

When was the cost of filling up the van set by you the customer. 5p off a litre is not a bargin if you have to buy over priced food too.

 

[Harbourwoodwork]

I thinck some of the pricing problem lies with the fact that a lot of the traditional carpentry jobs have have been eroded away,such as window fitting with the advent of plastic windows a job done by none trade personel one trick ponies with a mastic gun and that goes for all the other plastic products all ex carpentry jobs people are out there just hanging doors very cheap ,kitchen fitters that's another de skilled job ,its all good stuff until the jod get a bit demanding kitchen fitters are not wood workers as with floor layers ask them to cut a hatch,NO WE DONT DO THAT MATE, I go on could,I cant compete with these guys on price and i don' want to try, has anyone else seen the fruits of thier labour

 

[Norcon]

Is fitting a wooden window classed as "carpentry"? Would have thought any monkey could do that.
Making the actual wooden window would involve quite a lot of skill.
Lets say a traditional sliding sash.

 

[Harbourwoodwork]

Do you think norcon,On a job last year a sports club outside Folkstone, wiith 35ft glass fronted with doors and windows three guys turned up to fit it armed with a 3ft bubble and looked like they had just come of the door of a night club, handy lads,it wasn't straight it wasn't plumb and varied in direction of out of plumb all the way along ,so can a monkey do a job,I would say NO.

 

[mbga9pgf]

2 doors, 380 quid for a days work? Pretty steep but nowhere near as bad as those masked villains who fit wood burning stoves. 600 for a job that I ended up doing in half a day.

 

[calorific]

2 doors, 380 quid for a days work? Pretty steep but nowhere near as bad as those masked villains who fit wood burning stoves. 600 for a job that I ended up doing in half a day.

Talk about a dog with a bone

 

[Monkeh]

I do not know how much it costs to calibrate electrical test equipment but I do know that some domestic electrical engineers can fit all their tools, and the consumer unit, and the cable, and the back boxes, and face plates in an estate car, plus their short steps, oh, I must not forget the 6" spirit level that they don't use.

Multimeter - £400
Clamp meter - £270
Multifunction tester - £800
PAT tester (if needed) - £250
Additional voltage/continuty tester - £120
Backup tools - £plenty more

Yearly calibration - £christ knows, I'm bored of looking it up.

Don't underestimate the cost of proper tools for electrical work. Not mentioned here: Multiple sets of insulated screwdrivers, pliers, cutters, spanners, pipe bender capable of handling steel conduit, die set, socket sinker kit, holesaws, and the list certainly goes on. House bashers need not apply.

And before you have a go at me, I'm not knocking the work of carpenters, brickies, plumbers.. I hire all of you if I can't do the job well enough myself.

 

[calorific]

Straight question which I hope nobody takes umbrage with:

I've noticed far too often that works carried out by professional tradesmen in schools is all too often of a quality which I wouldn't accept at home, and in my experience both at home and in other people's houses, pro tradesmen who know their oats really are worth paying extra for since there's somethings that they have (called skill, experience, pride and speed). So the question is - do any of you lower your expectations when doing work in publically funded buildings, and if so, then why?