Electrician's Hourly Rates

[Murdochcat]

if its say a new board or wire an extension - it should prob be a fixed price.

Well, my estimates for board changes include a caveat for unexpected issues - never been challenged on this yet AND I never separate parts and Labour

As for extensions and rewires, the first thing is to agree a spec and a price - then make agreed changes as and when they crop up AND communicate them with the customer in writing

I’m not VAT reg either

 

[Murdochcat]

What I do is not relevant. I've merely been using my own situation as an example of how I think it probably should be done, again i all walks of life.

Kind Regards, John

Actually what you do is immensely relevant. You make broad brush statements about the pay rates of others but don’t disclose anything about yourself

Debate over me thinks as you aren’t conducting this in a meaningful manner

 

[JohnW2]

Artisan electrics have raised their prices from £80/hr+ vat to, £93.50/hr+ vat ... thats not the first hour, that’s per hour rate

I've been talking exclusively about self-employed people.

When one moves to those employed by 'service providers' (whether the services relate to electrical/plumbing/whatever work, car maintenance, solicitors or anything else) the employer's hourly 'charge out' rate for labour is dramatically more than the figures we are talking about, and dramatically more than the individuals actually doing the work get paid

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Unless you're talking about a big company like pimlico, why would an independent trader price a job and tell the customer how much they charge per hour? ... That's a calculation that you do in the background to give a quote.

Indeed so. Most customers are only interested in the bottom line, and have no interest in, or need to know, the 'hourly rate'.

As you imply, it's the 'hourly rate' used to calculate the total that matters, and that's what I'm talking about.

As I keep saying (using my own situation as an example), it seems to me that the obvious and fairest system would seem to be to calculate on the basis of an hourly rate (which includes 'fixed overheads'), which is the same wherever one lives or wherever one does the work, for the estimated number of hours involved, and then add to that an estimate of the specific additional expenses/outgoings (primarily travel related) that one estimates will be incurred in the course of doing the job in question (plus, of course, the cost of materials). What's wrong with that?

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Utter fiction, anyone charging those per hour is paying themselves/employees less than minimum wage.

I agree that some of the figures in that list are rather suspect, but that's not important to this discussion.I was merely indicating that (as we all know),what people regard as their 'hourly rate' varies considerably around the country.

Persons that demand hourly rates are usually the same ones that want extensive detailed lists of every single component and consumable. ...

It seems that I have not been clear enough. Most customers will have no interest or need to know anything about 'hourly rates'. I'm talking about the 'hourly rate' (which includes 'fixed overheads') that a self-employed person uses (together with materials cost and an estimate of job-specific expenses) to calculate the total amount to quote.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Pimlico's prices are silly, but they pay a lot for advertising and have to recoup that money. I generally try to steer my customers away from using them.

It seems that I have not been clear enough, since I have been talking exclusively about 'self-employed' trades people (whether literally self employed or constituted as tiny 'companies').

Significantly 'corporate' providers of services will always charge an awful lot more for a particular piece of work than the people who do the work get paid (or should expect to be paid if they were 'self-employed') - because of costs associated with premises, administration, marketing etc. and, last but by no means least, 'profit (over and above everything else).

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Personally I don’t think hourly rates are that helpful

They are not helpful to most customers but, as I keep saying, their relevance (and what I've been talking about) is that they are used to calculate the total amount to quote to/charge a customer.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

Actually what you do is immensely relevant.

It's not, but I suppose I brought this on myself.

I could just as easily have talked about 'how I believe it should be done' (which happens to be the way in which it IS done in fields I work in), without mentioning my own position at all.

 

[JohnW2]

Well, my estimates for board changes include a caveat for unexpected issues ...

We all do that - usually by adding a generous amount of 'contingency provision' onto our estimate of the number of hours of work that will be required.

- never been challenged on this yet AND I never separate parts and Labour

That's fair enough for most customers but, as I keep saying, the issue I'm talking about is the notional 'hourly rate' you use when calculating what to charge.

 

[JohnW2]

Thats a very important point to make, a lot of this is down to what is generally accepted as acceptable for a market or region, even when it seems like it should be similar to something else.

As I've intimated, I think that is probably the crunch. In many walks of life it has come to be 'accepted' that services (and to some extent goods) will cost a lot more in some parts of the country as in other parts, without necessarily giving enough thought to how justified that actually is - a bit like installing 6mm² (or even 10mm²) cooker circuits, or always installing ring final circuits "because that's how it's always been done.

As I've said, I suspect the reason for this 'acceptance' is that, at least in some contexts, people expect (and partially accept) incomes to be higher in parts of the country where the cost of housing and the 'cost of living' is higher. However, as I've said, countless millions of employed people (including most of those who have been striking in recent times) have to accept nationally-agreed pay figures which vary little, if anything, according to where they live in the country. So, whilst I can certainly sympathise with those who need enough income to support their living in an 'expensive area', I don't see why, for example, self-employed tradespeople should be 'spared' that problem.

Kind Regards, John

 

[JohnW2]

You're allowed to edit it down

I am - but the issue was someone else's post that I was quoting, which I didn't want to edit.

Where are the clients though? Tell your London client your rate is £50 an hour, and their response will probably be the same as telling your Lincoln clients your rate is £25 an hour.

Quite possibly - but, again, the question is "Why?"

My job can largely be performed remote, and London companies that hire for it typically pay a different rate depending on where the worker lives/incurs costs..

I must say, I've never heard of, or come across that - and am not sure how it can be justified - or, indeed, why I client should be happy to pay a lot more for the same service because the provider has chosen to live in an 'expensive' area.

In fact, in relation to remote work, clients will often not have a clue as to where the service provider does live. I have a colleague who often works with me on the same projects for a particular client. He has a UK address and phone number and spends a lot of time in 'virtual meetings' (Zoom etc.) with clients but, unknown to virtually all his clients, he actually lives in Bangkok. He is paid the same of me (which is fair enough as far as the client is concerned) but I hate to think how little they might pay him if they took 'where he lives' into account (given that his rent for a very plush 'condo' out there is a lot less than my Council Tax bill!)

Kind Regards, John

 

[OvertonPlumber]

This is about plumbers but its very similar to sparks.

PLUMBERNOMICS - Culkin Plumbing and Heating

How much to expect to pay a plumber or tradesmen and the economics lying behind these rates. Comparison of plumbers wages in employment and business to business

www.culkinplumbingandheating.co.uk

 

[Murdochcat]

^^ that’s an interesting read

My business costs last financial year were around £7k

No advertising except website hosting, van owned outright

 

[flameport]

van owned outright

That is unrelated, you must allow a certain amount for vehicle replacement every year, as that van wasn't free and it won't last forever.

£7k for everything seems implausibly low.

 

[JohnD]

^^ that’s an interesting read

My business costs last financial year were around £7k

No advertising except website hosting, van owned outright

Of course, the business also paid your pension contributions, your holiday pay, your sick pay, and your professional registrations.