GAS SAFE question related to HOB

[DP]

In my time I have seen gas hobs fitted with 8mm microbore pipe, 15mm pipe fitted that does not allow oven to fit properly, cooker hoses used etc. I have seen homeowners lurking in B&Q plumbing section and gazing with utter confusion at plethora of gubbins there. Am not surprised hoses are prefered to fit hobs just like flexible pipes to plum sinks, baths and basins.

If the householder was to see what can happen when cooker hose splits to cause a gas leak and possibly start a fire, I am sure hose+gas hob query would be laid to rest for ever.

As a RGI, for me it will ALWAYS be a 15mm copper connection for a gas hob EVEN when a manual says a hose COULD be used.

 

[onecog]

I've seen a cooker bayonet fitted back to front with the bayonet fitting screwed into the cooker and the hose screwed into the copper

 

[MrsTaraPlumbing]

BS6172:2010 11.1.3
Hob can be fitted with a flexible connector unless MI states otherwise.

- I also thought it had to be rigid pipework - but I don't need to know in my job.

Of course RGI who do cookers will know that the standard goes on to say other important safety stuff about flexible connections.

DIYers should be aware that putting the "flexible connector" on the hob is "gas work" and so the person doing it needs to be competent.

 

[hazetimesfive]

depends, 'work' is defined as anything requiring a tool.

 

[MrsTaraPlumbing]

depends, 'work' is defined as anything requiring a tool.

"Work" has a specific definition in the Gas Safety Regs 1998 and anyone working on gas should be aware or this and other parts of those regs.
The official guidence to those regs (the ACOP) says that the definition of Gas Work and all other parts of the Gas Safety Rgs equally apply to those doing gas work in the course of their job and those doing it as DIY.

Haze - I see you a gas mn and will know what I mean but other clearly don't like thoseDIY folk mentioned who fit it all backwards and upside down!

 

[hazetimesfive]

just the way they broke it down to me at school

 

[bolshy]

“work” in relation to a gas fitting includes any of the following activities carried out by any person, whether an employee or not, that is to say—
(a)installing or re-connecting the fitting;
(b)maintaining, servicing, permanently adjusting, disconnecting, repairing, altering or renewing the fitting or purging it of air or gas;
(c)where the fitting is not readily movable, changing its position; and
(d)removing the fitting;
but the expression does not include the connection or disconnection of a bayonet fitting or other self-sealing connector.

 

[hazetimesfive]

But it would include a tightness test afterwards no?

 

[bolshy]

Connecting/disconnecting a bayonet doesn't constitute "work" on a gas fitting as defined in the regs. That doesn't mean the valve won't leak when bayonet is removed. Squirt of LDF for RGIs, or TT. If it's to be left disconnected for an extended period, I'd cap/plug it and TT.
DIYers should be strongly advised not to disconnect anyway. They may be in breach of the regs if they do as a fitted gas hob is a FIXED appliance, and as such won't need to have it's bayonet disconnected for any reason.
Hard piping is the answer imo.
Bit of a grey area tbh, could do with a Gas Safe Tech Bullet to clarify.

 

[MrsTaraPlumbing]

Connecting/disconnecting a bayonet doesn't constitute "work" on a gas fitting as defined in the regs. .

That is correct - except if someone is doing it in the course of their work - eg kitchen fitters, builders removal companies - according to TB - because other Health & Safety at Work legislation applies.

But connecting the hose itself is "work" - pipework - i believe.

 

[DickieP]

Certainly a flexi could be used IF the makers agreed.

But as far as I am aware on all the Bosch hobs a rigid pipe is needed so thats not helpful to the OP.

Having seen a kitchen burnt by a flexi hose on a hob I would certainly treat them as very risky.

I would be likely to class on a CP12 as At Risk although I suppose some might just say NCS.

They are usually following an illegal DIY installation of the hob too!

You can't call them CP12s anymore Tony, it must be a 'Gas Safety Certificate', that's what the little sh.t of a Gas Safe inspector told me anyway??

 

[bolshy]

They're not a certificate - it's not an award. It's a Gas Safety Report. The engineer is recording what he finds, pass or fail.

 

[bolshy]

That is correct - except if someone is doing it in the course of their work - eg kitchen fitters, builders removal companies - according to TB - because other Health & Safety at Work legislation applies.

But connecting the hose itself is "work" - pipework - i believe.

That is why I said it's a grey area. A fitted hob isn't something that you move about. It's fixed. An unregistered kitchen fitter can't commission a hob, so why connect it at all? And surely you'd call an RGI to disconnect your hob, not a local kitchen or removal firm?
Legislation written for free standing cookers muddies the waters a bit, I think.

 

[simond]

I'm confused as to the message here.

Disconnecting a flexible hose to either a cooker- or a hob if appropriate - from a bayonet, is not 'work' as described in the GSIUR.

The bayonet is designed to be used by unskilled workers and is assumed to be gas tight when removed. I checked this with gas safe myself as one of my chaps wanted to remove a redundant bayonet for safety reasons. We had a difference of opinion and I rang them to clarify.

 

[bolshy]

You're right. A self sealing valve is assumed to be gas tight. But I don't like them when they're associated with fixed hobs.
I'd rather not leave an unused bayonet fitting. Here's why.

I went to an empty house refurb, new hob to be connected and commissioned on a flexible. Pipe work was already in place.
The kitchen fitter, (obviously in a rush), had already connected the hob and had pulled the flexible so tight I was amazed he got the bayonet in. It was under a LOT of strain. The hob was over a full unit away from the bayonet wall fitting and wasn't fixed to the worktop at all. Gas supply was on.

Customer had changed her mind about hob position not long after kitchen work had started. She was unaware it had already been (badly) fitted, and hadn't told me the hob's final position had moved.

Before this visit, I was the most recent RGI at that property, as I was upgrading the gas pipe work for her a couple of weeks before.

So, an unregistered fitter carried out illegal gas work and made a hash of it, because of a tempting, easy to connect flexible and bayonet.
If an accident had occurred relating to the hob before my return, would I have been in the clear?
I think not........even though I didn't install it.
I sorted it, but makes you think........of hard piping