God does not exist - discuss

[jockscott]

But,, MFL, according to the bible (and creationists) the age of the Earth (and therefore the universe,, God created light and saw that it was good) is only about 6000 yrs old. Explain to me in simple terms, how the light reaching us from the furthest stars happens to be millions of years old ?? ( if everything is a lot younger (by a factor of millions)

 

[Mikefromlondon]

But,, MFL, according to the bible (and creationists) the age of the Earth (and therefore the universe,, God created light and saw that it was good) is only about 6000 yrs old. Explain to me in simple terms, how the light reaching us from the furthest stars happens to be millions of years old ?? ( if everything is a lot younger (by a factor of millions)

I have my own explanation for your question, unproven of course, and you may not find it acceptable, and you don't have to.

If God created our present universes 13.5 Billion years ago, the age being according to our Scientific knowledge, the process of creation takes time, once all the dust settled, earth cooled down, years passed away, conditions became settled and just right, our solar system stabilized, and then organisms started to appear as per God's plan, his laws he laid at the time of creation started to work together and the process of creation started, dinosaurs appeared on earth, as evidently found through fossil records, and then may be , may be God thought what the heck is this huge and ugly creature that evolved which may not be intended, and it is destroying all smaller creatures, so he better destroy it before the smaller creatures are wiped out, so he wiped out the dinosaurs by sending a large object crashing down to earth causing dinosaur's destruction, leaving other smaller evolved species intact or most survived, to continue to evolve, God then he sat back and he was still not very happy and thought what if he creates a new kind of being called a man, so may be he borrowed a monkey's DNA, modified it and made a new man with superior intelligence through modifying an Ape gene, and give the new man he created the ability to think and create things of his own, and see how far his new man would go, however, because he gave man an intelligence to understand and speak, so God told man that he is his creator and would like him to follow certain rules, and if he deviates from these rules the consequences could become unbearable, today man with independent mind, intelligence has taken many strides, but he has failed to see his creator's work, blinded by his own arrogance.

So here we are, if it says 6000 years in the bible that is good enough for me. Despite the age of the universe itself could be billions of years older.

And of course our intelligence is not bound by any force, we could one day become God like and create new life of our own design, we may need to borrow building blocks from other species to create new species, this may all be Gods ultimate plan, and who knows the new species of super-human created thus, may destroy us humans (might as well if we are continually fighting over religions) and the new super-human species would be far more intelligent to worry about religions and may work out his ultimate source - God, which we can't seem to work out, or deny there is someone behind all this creation.

I am sure pretty soon, may not be during my life time, but soon after, scientists themselves will discover God, the reason behind creation, and will work to contact him and acknowledge him. We would also discover other forms of Alien lives, on other planets, and discover aliens have also been coming to earth already and some advanced civilisations who have already discovered God.

Man has always been intrigued of his source, that is what the science is doing, where we came from, why we came and how we came here and ultimately who was responsible for it all. this will take us beyond the big bang.

 

[JBR]

God is an Architect of the Universe.

Nonsense. He's a town planner.

Who else, when designing the anatomy of a woman, would place the pleasure gardens right between the waterworks and the sewage farm?

 

[breadnbutter]

Proof positive that brainwashing from an early age works then B&B

is that all you can come up whith. the we are brainwashed is boring now.

Ahh, Hello Joe, is this one of your other persona?? You really should get this schizophrenia seen to.

yeh right, and all you know is jackscott.

 

[Mikefromlondon]

God is an Architect of the Universe.

Nonsense. He's a town planner.

Who else, when designing the anatomy of a woman, would place the pleasure gardens right between the waterworks and the sewage farm?

true, I agree to some extent, why didn't he also give us a third eye on the rear of our head to watch for back stabbers. I often wonder.

 

[breadnbutter]

But,, MFL, according to the bible (and creationists) the age of the Earth (and therefore the universe,, God created light and saw that it was good) is only about 6000 yrs old. Explain to me in simple terms, how the light reaching us from the furthest stars happens to be millions of years old ?? ( if everything is a lot younger (by a factor of millions)

genesis, does not say how old the universe is, or how old the planet is.

it declares in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

it does not say when that beginning was. in respect to the universe,and the planet. only that God created it.

God is eternal he is outside of time. time is for our benefit.

i believe the the planet that God created was around long before God created life on earth.
becuase it says , 2 The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.
so it is possible that the earth was a frozen planet long before LIFE ,becuase there was no light,or sun. as it says,and DARKNESS was on the face of the deep.

then genesis , declares that God started to create life on earth,the first thing needed was light i.e the sun. God said, let there be light.
then he divided the light from the darkness, in other words he spun the earth. he called the light day,and the darkness he called night,so the evening and the morning were the first day, and that is the introduction of time for man.

the creation of LIFE on earth was just under 7000 years ago. we are only
30 to 40 years short of the 7000 years.

 

[Mikefromlondon]

But,, MFL, according to the bible (and creationists) the age of the Earth (and therefore the universe,, God created light and saw that it was good) is only about 6000 yrs old. Explain to me in simple terms, how the light reaching us from the furthest stars happens to be millions of years old ?? ( if everything is a lot younger (by a factor of millions)

genesis, does not say how old the universe is, or how old the planet is.

it declares in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

it does not say when that beginning was. in respect to the universe,and the planet. only that God created it.

God is eternal he is outside of time. time is for our benefit.

i believe the the planet that God created was around long before God created life on earth.
becuase it says , 2 The earth was without form, and void; and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.
so it is possible that the earth was a frozen planet long before LIFE ,becuase there was no light,or sun. as it says,and DARKNESS was on the face of the deep.

then genesis , declares that God started to create life on earth,the first thing needed was light i.e the sun. God said, let there be light.
then he divided the light from the darkness, in other words he spun the earth. he called the light day,and the darkness he called night,so the evening and the morning were the first day, and that is the introduction of time for man.

the creation of LIFE on earth was just under 7000 years ago. we are only
30 to 40 years short of the 7000 years.

makes total sense.

 

[sooey]

You two should get some help.

 

[wobs]

In which book does the mian protagonist kill between 2 and 24million people (depending on how you read it), but the bad guy only kills 10?
The Bible.

eg. God sends forth two bears to kill forty-two children for making fun of Elisha’s bald head (2 Kings 2:23-24).

Some real juicy bits here:
Anyone who goes uncircumcised is to be exiled from his people (Genesis 17:14).

If a man has sex with a menstruating women, both are to be exiled (Leviticus 20:18).

A man who marries a mother and daughter must burn in a fire (Leviticus 20:14).

If two men have sexual relations, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:13).

If a mother and son have sexual relations, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:11).

If a man and daughter-in-law have sex, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:12).

If a man has sex with an animal, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:15).

If a woman has sex with an animal, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:16).

Anyone who attacks his mother or father must be put to death (Exodus 21:15).

Anyone who curses his mother or father must be put to death (Leviticus 20:9).

Anyone who commits murder must be put to death (Leviticus 24:17).

Anyone who commits adultery must be put to death (Deuteronomy 22:22).

Anyone who commits perjury must be put to death (Deuteronomy 19:18-19).

Anyone who commits kidnapping must be put to death (Exodus 21:16).

Anyone who disobeys a judge or priest must be put to death (Deuteronomy 17:12).

Anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death (Exodus 35:2).

Anyone who does not worship God must be put to death (2 Chronicles 15:13).

Any strangers approaching a sanctuary must be put to death (Numbers 17:7).

Any prophet who tries to turn you against God must be put to death (Deuteronomy 13:5).

Any prophet who makes a wrong prediction must be put to death (Deuteronomy 18:20-22).

Family members who tempt you with other gods must be put to death (Deuteronomy 13:1-5).

If an ox gores someone, the ox and its owner must be stoned to death (Exodus 21:29).

Anyone who claims to talk with spirits must be stoned to death (Leviticus 20:27).

A stubborn and rebellious son must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 21:18-21).

Any woman who has had premarital sex must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 22:21).

Anyone who worships another god must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 17:2-7).

Anyone who curses or blasphemes must be stoned to death (Leviticus 24:14-16).

Break the neck of your donkey’s firstborn or kill a lamb instead (Exodus 34:20).

If a city worships other gods, kill everyone in it and burn it (Deuteronomy 13:12-16)
http://www.biblicalnonsense.com/chapter9.html

 

[sooey]

Anyone who disobeys a judge or priest must be put to death

Therein lies the nub.

 

[breadnbutter]

In which book does the mian protagonist kill between 2 and 24million people (depending on how you read it), but the bad guy only kills 10?
The Bible.

eg. God sends forth two bears to kill forty-two children for making fun of Elisha’s bald head (2 Kings 2:23-24).

Some real juicy bits here:
Anyone who goes uncircumcised is to be exiled from his people (Genesis 17:14).

If a man has sex with a menstruating women, both are to be exiled (Leviticus 20:18).

A man who marries a mother and daughter must burn in a fire (Leviticus 20:14).

If two men have sexual relations, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:13).

If a mother and son have sexual relations, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:11).

If a man and daughter-in-law have sex, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:12).

If a man has sex with an animal, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:15).

If a woman has sex with an animal, both must be put to death (Leviticus 20:16).

Anyone who attacks his mother or father must be put to death (Exodus 21:15).

Anyone who curses his mother or father must be put to death (Leviticus 20:9).

Anyone who commits murder must be put to death (Leviticus 24:17).

Anyone who commits adultery must be put to death (Deuteronomy 22:22).

Anyone who commits perjury must be put to death (Deuteronomy 19:18-19).

Anyone who commits kidnapping must be put to death (Exodus 21:16).

Anyone who disobeys a judge or priest must be put to death (Deuteronomy 17:12).

Anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death (Exodus 35:2).

Anyone who does not worship God must be put to death (2 Chronicles 15:13).

Any strangers approaching a sanctuary must be put to death (Numbers 17:7).

Any prophet who tries to turn you against God must be put to death (Deuteronomy 13:5).

Any prophet who makes a wrong prediction must be put to death (Deuteronomy 18:20-22).

Family members who tempt you with other gods must be put to death (Deuteronomy 13:1-5).

If an ox gores someone, the ox and its owner must be stoned to death (Exodus 21:29).

Anyone who claims to talk with spirits must be stoned to death (Leviticus 20:27).

A stubborn and rebellious son must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 21:18-21).

Any woman who has had premarital sex must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 22:21).

Anyone who worships another god must be stoned to death (Deuteronomy 17:2-7).

Anyone who curses or blasphemes must be stoned to death (Leviticus 24:14-16).

Break the neck of your donkey’s firstborn or kill a lamb instead (Exodus 34:20).

If a city worships other gods, kill everyone in it and burn it (Deuteronomy 13:12-16)
http://www.biblicalnonsense.com/chapter9.html[/QUOTE]


The problem of you dishing this out,as if its all evil,and bad is you have no understanding or the full context, of what its about and why,you just blarsay, its evil. whithout understanding.

by the way we are not under these laws,but under grace.

 

[sooey]

What context could you possibly put those in that would make them seem ok to you?

 

[wobs]

[

The problem of you dishing this out,as if its all evil,and bad is you have no understanding or the full context, of what its about and why,you just blarsay, its evil. whithout understanding.

by the way we are not under these laws,but under grace.

You assume wrong.
It shows that religion is not the morally superior entity it is protrayed to be.

While there may be good bits, we must not forget that the Bible is riddled with inconsistencies, and morally bankrupt actions in the name of God. That we have dropped such rules and values reflects not religion, but our intelligence.

We do not need religion to be good or moral people.

 

[breadnbutter]

[

The problem of you dishing this out,as if its all evil,and bad is you have no understanding or the full context, of what its about and why,you just blarsay, its evil. whithout understanding.

by the way we are not under these laws,but under grace.

You assume wrong.
It shows that religion is not the morally superior entity it is protrayed to be.

While there may be good bits, we must not forget that the Bible is riddled with inconsistencies, and morally bankrupt actions in the name of God. That we have dropped such rules and values reflects not religion, but our intelligence.

We do not need religion to be good or moral people.

i can assure you , that if you understood it, which takes time. you would understand why it says what it says. whithout twisting it. its the truth.
it hides nothing.

maybe in your own standards you can be good and moral, but being good alone wont save you, being religiose wont save you.

ultimately its not about religion,its about a relationship whith God and man. and that sin is the reason that seperates man from god. and jesus
is the one that takes away the sin of man,so we can have that relationship again whith god.

 

[wobs]

[

The problem of you dishing this out,as if its all evil,and bad is you have no understanding or the full context, of what its about and why,you just blarsay, its evil. whithout understanding.

by the way we are not under these laws,but under grace.

You assume wrong.
It shows that religion is not the morally superior entity it is protrayed to be.

While there may be good bits, we must not forget that the Bible is riddled with inconsistencies, and morally bankrupt actions in the name of God. That we have dropped such rules and values reflects not religion, but our intelligence.

We do not need religion to be good or moral people.

i can assure you , that if you understood it, which takes time. you would understand why it says what it says. whithout twisting it. its the truth.
it hides nothing.

maybe in your own standards you can be good and moral, but being good alone wont save you, being religiose wont save you.

ultimately its not about religion,its about a relationship whith God and man. and that sin is the reason that seperates man from god. and jesus
is the one that takes away the sin of man,so we can have that relationship again whith god.

You assume we need saving, and to have relationship with god. We don't as he doesn't exist.

We have seen a few examples of where the bible falls down morally, but there are absurdities abound as well. If you cherry pick the bits that make you feel like a good christian (or other religious follower), then what does that say about your belief system?

You're starting out on a false premise, that to be good, you must follow some being who shows no evidence of existence. Faith tells us nothing about whether something exists or not. It just tells us about the person. And even then it tells us nothing about their moral character, as we have seen time and again in religious communities.

Dawkin said that relgious people are simply sucking up to god. I think this is a crude way of putting it, and not that accurate, but it isn't far off.