There are cranes on much higher buildings in colder climates than ours.
Moscow IBC for instance, that don't seem to suffer any problems.
Helicopter and crane.
- Thread starter empip
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There are cranes on much higher buildings in colder climates than ours.
Moscow IBC for instance, that don't seem to suffer any problems.
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in the paper yesterday it was reported that he had a problem with a previous flight with passengers(years back) and because of his experience he managed to land the helicopter without anyone being seriously hurt,and accordingly to the article the type of accident he had then no one should've walked away.
think this is why he has been hailed a hero?.
I think if you ask me for my opinion, those close by to the accident area have have been very lucky that more people didn't die, had that building been completed already, then what were the chances of him crashing straight into that building! like the WTC, he just missed it by a few yards (oh I forgot meters! )
But question is what was a helicopter pilot doing up there in a bad weather? if he was so experienced, then should he not know better?
I am not digging at the poor man he died in this tragic accident, but the question is who forced him to fly that day? his boss? his company?
The police were saying tyat their helicopter wasn't flying that day due to bad visibility.
But question is what was a helicopter pilot doing up there in a bad weather? if he was so experienced, then should he not know better?
I am not digging at the poor man he died in this tragic accident, but the question is who forced him to fly that day? his boss? his company?
The police were saying tyat their helicopter wasn't flying that day due to bad visibility.
Funnily enough ice is less of a problem in very cold weather. The temperature at the surface was around -3C, so at 1000ft it would be (around) -5C. It's quite possible for water in a cloud at that temperature to still be liquid, but if a piece of cold metal arrives (eg a helicopter) then the water will freeze on the helicopter.
If the temperature in the cloud is, say, -20C then it's far far less likely that the cloud has liquid water in it as it will have frozen. It will have ice in it, and the ice will bounce off the helicopter so not stick.
It's the build up of ice on the aircraft which is quite frankly frigging dangerous.
The forecast I quoted above which was issued at 04:59 on that morning says
TAF EGLC 160459Z 1606/1615 08004KT 0800 FZFG BKN001
between 6am and 3pm:
FZFG means Freezing Fog i.e they are forecasting such icing conditions
BKN001 means clouds start at 100ft so getting under these conditions is not doable
So the information was available in advance that the weather was unsuitable for such light aircraft flights.
There are words 'get-home-itis' and 'press-on-itis' in the flying world. People decide to fly into innapropriate weather conditions because of pressures to get home, to pick somebody up, to do something which really doesn't warrant the risks involved.
This happens to experienced pilots too. 'Failure to maintain visible separation' is the probable cause of far too many accidents, everybody knows it is dangerous to fly close to the ground or tall buildings when you cannot actually see them, yet these accidents still happen. The goal is to learn from these accidents to prevent more.
Though the insurance company will pay out depending on who was to blame. And the poor guy on the ground who had zero part in the decision making for that flight is dead.
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Probably different operational reasons. May have been perfectly safe and legal to fly but not suitable for police ops.
For accuracy BKN001 actually means broken clouds at 100 feet. Broken clouds are defined as 6/10th to 9/10th of sky covered with cloud. A forecast not an actual weather report nearly 3 hours before the accident.
Freezing fog is forecast when fog is present or expected and the air temperature is below 0°C.
Your explanation of airframe icing is really pushing it!
Are you anti helicopters? A pilot? A wannabe? Please enlighten us so people can base their opinions on the remarks of a professional helicopter pilot or on your comments.
W.
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Chapeau is a consultant medical doctor - so he tells us. He earns £18K per year - so he tells us. He's got more degrees than he's got fingers - so he tells us.
It's the Internet folks - be who you want to be.
This week he's a helicopter pilot.
It's the Internet folks - be who you want to be.
This week he's a helicopter pilot.
no no no no no Joe.
That's what you tell us. You ain't going to find anypost on this site where I say what I do for a living.
Who knows, I may be a helicopter pilot, I may not be a helicopter pilot. All you need to know is that everything I said on this thread is correct and far more insightful than anybody elses posts.
That's why Mr Professional Helicopter Pilot is replying to my posts and not yours. That's because he knows I've got a point, and he's defending the reputation of the pilot who died. Whereas he knows you're just a numskull.
That's what you tell us. You ain't going to find anypost on this site where I say what I do for a living.
Who knows, I may be a helicopter pilot, I may not be a helicopter pilot. All you need to know is that everything I said on this thread is correct and far more insightful than anybody elses posts.
That's why Mr Professional Helicopter Pilot is replying to my posts and not yours. That's because he knows I've got a point, and he's defending the reputation of the pilot who died. Whereas he knows you're just a numskull.
No, I am responding to your posts because they are factually inaccurate and you are trying to confuse people or con them into believing you know what you are talking about - that needs to be corrected for accuracy.
Unfortunately you are a troll who is simply cutting and pasting/googling things because you are anti helicopters/pilots/aviation. If you were a pilot or aviation professional you would have no issue with telling people your qualifications or ratings.
If anyone cares to pm me I will happily provide the link to the database that will confirm I am actually a commercial helicopter pilot and not a troll or wannabe. I am thinking that you will not/cannot do the same.
This is the real world not MS Flightsim.
W.
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Probably an unidentified Audi driver could help :-
...In 2004, Mr Barnes carried out a daring rescue of a motorist from a flooded ford in County Durham while working for the Great North Air Ambulance (GNAA).
The paramedic who flew with him on that mission, Kevin Hodgson, said he was one of the best pilots he had ever flown with.
Mr Barnes had to hover just a foot above the car, holding the helicopter steady as Hodgson lowered himself onto the roof.
After the rescue he told the Journal: He said: "It wasn't a run of the mill rescue. Some quick decisions had to be made and the timing was crucial, but fortunately everything went like clockwork.
"I've worked on some action movies in my time, but Kevin is a real hero climbing onto the roof of that car - although what the man was doing trying to go across Stanhope Ford, God only knows."...
http://tinyurl.com/bbvge7p
It must be true to say helicopter usage by the Air Ambulance have saved more lives than they have taken - It is said the pilot had at least 8 yrs Air Ambulance service...
-0-
Ah, but the real question is has the money spent on the air ambulance been money well spent.
i.e. would the money have saved more lives if spent on motorcycle paramedics.....
I used to hang out with the medevac (helicopter ambulance) crew when I lived in the States. The pilots were all crusty ex Vietnam vets, they had experience in spades and judgement that was completely solid. They wouldn't risk the lives of their crew by hovering 1ft over a car in a flooded river. And the crew wouldn't have got in the back if they thought that was going to happen !
i.e. would the money have saved more lives if spent on motorcycle paramedics.....
I used to hang out with the medevac (helicopter ambulance) crew when I lived in the States. The pilots were all crusty ex Vietnam vets, they had experience in spades and judgement that was completely solid. They wouldn't risk the lives of their crew by hovering 1ft over a car in a flooded river. And the crew wouldn't have got in the back if they thought that was going to happen !
Now I know you are a troll!
I spent 15 years as a paramedic (again I am able to provide the link to the HPC register to show my continued registration) and all fast response vehicles whether they are cars or motorbikes achieve is to get a paramedic or technician to the patient sometimes quicker than an ambulance. The seriously ill patients still need transport to hospital by land or air ambulance.
I now live and fly in the USA and I assure you that all the police, fire and medivac pilots will give 110% to save a patient if it can be safely done. One crew even winched a stranded dog from a flooded river last year here in LA - perfectly safe operation.
As I previously said unless chapeau is prepared to substanciate his qualifications to make comments on the subject I would treat him as no more than an internet Walter Mitty.
W.
heh heh heh
I've been called worse than that on here I can promise you.
Yes 'if it can be safely done'. Judgement call......
Somebody crashed into a crane in dreadful weather which had been forecast prior to the decision to take off.
An innocent person on the ground died.
Judgement is everything, because lets face facts, the hardest part about flying an aircraft is making the money for your lessons.
I hope you are enjoying flying in the US. It's a completely different approach to flying out there than what you get in the UK. I could tell you didn't know much about helicopter flying over London when you started going on about IFR, different rules for flying over cities in the US..... And London is class A to the surface.....
I've been called worse than that on here I can promise you.
Yes 'if it can be safely done'. Judgement call......
Somebody crashed into a crane in dreadful weather which had been forecast prior to the decision to take off.
An innocent person on the ground died.
Judgement is everything, because lets face facts, the hardest part about flying an aircraft is making the money for your lessons.
I hope you are enjoying flying in the US. It's a completely different approach to flying out there than what you get in the UK. I could tell you didn't know much about helicopter flying over London when you started going on about IFR, different rules for flying over cities in the US..... And London is class A to the surface.....
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