Interest rates up

[motorbiking]

Why did you vote remain?

 

[ellal]

Why did you vote remain?

If you're talking to me, then for the benefits that the EU offers...

Namely the freedom of movement/employment/healthcare/education/protection of rights/free trade/UK influence, amongst many other things.

And to also try and ensure that these rights pass down to our following generations - sadly quitters don't seem to care too much about those issues or those following generations!

And equally sad is that no quitter can actually say exactly what they were personally voting against!

 

[motorbiking]

For me it was:
- getting very focused on Euro countries and seeing those outside as second class members
- a feeling that it rarely passed legislation that helped the UK economy and often tried to chip away at it.
- a bit expensive for what we got. (i.e. the countries that are net contributors vs those that were not)

But the main thing was a view that countries should form bi-lateral trade agreements, which reflect the specific needs of the 2, rather than block-collective negotiations which don't benefit larger countries.

In other words - I felt we could do it better outside and it might cost us less.

 

[JohnD]

bi-lateral trade agreements....could do it better outside and it might cost us less.

Can you give some examples of countries that we might be able to agree such better agreements with, after we've given up our EU membership?

 

[ellal]

In other words - I felt we could do it better outside and it might cost us less.

So here's a couple of genuine questions.

Given what we know now/were lied to about, prior to the vote... and given the current state of the Brexit 'negotiations'/reality of the situation.

Do you still feel the same?

And exactly how much of that 'European legislation' do you think 'chipped away' at our economy as opposed to what our own successive governments have inflicted on us?

 

[EddieM]

So here's a couple of genuine questions.

Given what we know now/were lied to about, prior to the vote... and given the current state of the Brexit 'negotiations'/reality of the situation.

Do you still feel the same?

And exactly how much of that 'European legislation' do you think 'chipped away' at our economy as opposed to what our own successive governments have inflicted on us?

Suppose it would depend on who you ask, a fisherman may bend your ear for a while.

Or maybe UK market traders, who for some reason follow EU hygiene rules, that the French simply ignore....

 

[EddieM]

Then i suppose theres CAP which is a ludicrous scheme to prop up French farming.

 

[ellal]

Suppose it would depend on who you ask, a fisherman may bend your ear for a while.

Or maybe UK market traders, who for some reason follow EU hygiene rules, that the French simply ignore....

I guess you've been talking to people who tell you the things you want to hear...

Maybe you ought to ask why UK fishermen were quite happy to sell their licences at a large profit and then bellyache at those they sold them to?

And maybe you could illustrate where the French are any worse at observing EU hygiene rules?
I'm assuming you are referring to the food chain (not DM showering habit reports), so where does the UK stand in the hygiene list?

 

[EddieM]

Certainly true that UK fishing had been mismanaged, but thankfully for us most of the prime UK fishing grounds lie to the north of scotland which would not be contentious to an extent to foreign owned vessels, there are potential benefits, but as usual, its neithet the Daily Fail or the Grauniad that will give you the true picture... if there is one... re Hygiene, just go to a French market... they're great.... but terribly "unhygienic"

 

[Yafo]

Certainly true that UK fishing had been mismanaged, but thankfully for us most of the prime UK fishing grounds lie to the north of scotland which would not be contentious to an extent to foreign owned vessels, there are potential benefits, but as usual, its neithet the Daily Fail or the Grauniad that will give you the true picture... if there is one... re Hygiene, just go to a French market... they're great.... but terribly "unhygienic"

Interesting observation. Obviously we go to different areas and markets. Never seen any real issue at french markets, certainly no different to uk markets.

What hygeine rules do they ignore ? I might be wrong, but I think there have been far more food and safety issues in the UK than in france over last few years. Be interesting to see the opposite proven true.

 

[ellal]

Certainly true that UK fishing had been mismanaged, but thankfully for us most of the prime UK fishing grounds lie to the north of scotland which would not be contentious to an extent to foreign owned vessels

You obviously don't realise that the main traditional fish stocks have largely migrated to Icelandic/Norwegian waters due to the warming seas.
Link

You could of course go and have a word with their 'foreign owned vessels' if you like, but they (the Icelanders) kicked our arse the last two times

re Hygiene, just go to a French market... they're great.... but terribly "unhygienic"

In what way?

It's all very well talking about your observations, but I'd equally say that the ones I've been to (and it's many) have had impeccable standards...
(unlike English ones its usually look but don't touch)

But there must be a statistical analysis somewhere to back up your claim?

 

[Yafo]

In other words - I felt we could do it better outside and it might cost us less.

Do you still think that is possible? Or likely ?

 

[ellal]

Do you still think that is possible? Or likely ?

I have asked that time and time again...

And yet not a single quitter I've talked to/met with/conversed on line with/watched on TV/listened to in debate, has ever given me an answer to that...

And they have also never given me a single valid reason as to how the EU has affected them personally to their detriment !

 

[JohnD]

Can you give some examples of countries that we might be able to agree such better agreements with, after we've given up our EU membership?

unsurprisingly, he can't.

 

[motorbiking]

- I didn't expect leave to win and I could have easily voted remain with the view that better the known than the unknown - I was very much on the fence at the time. I was swayed by the view that in 10-15 years within the EU, I thought we'd be definitely worse off. I didn't pay much attention to the campaigning.

- Yes longer term I think we will be better off, block trading collectives will hopefully become irrelevant, trade deals will hopefully become irrelevant, businesses wont trade the way they do now, economics will be about the attractiveness of a country to do business in, not access to markets. but much of that depends on what happens with the EU and how long it takes for the next crisis. There is a power shift from Europe as a whole and the EU's approach is protectionism, not transformation.
- Trade is a whole package of things, its not just free movement of goods and services, its taxes, incentives etc.. Our hands were very much tied.

We have some fundamental strengths, language, tax freedoms, openness.

A question for remainers: do you think the direction the EU was heading (expansion, federalisation etc) was going to be better or worse for the UK?

I have to declare that I've personally benefited from Brexit so far. (I do business mostly in USD)