Intsalling heavy tiles in victorian bathroom

[liam546]

How many external walls did you insulate? I have 3 external walls in my bathroom so ideally I would need to do all three. Bathroom suite is bought with seperate shower and bath. I have a reasonable large bathroom but with the seperate shower I've cramped quite a bit in. I'm just a little worried that itl all be too cramped if I reduce floor area too. My area currently is 2.6 x3.3 meters with a 1x1 airing cupboard in the corner.

I should find out today the weight of the 95x45 Italian porcelain tiles which I'll report back

 

[TheVictorian]

I insulated 2 walls, when you look at 5cm in terms of the overall space then I doubt you'd notice.

 

[3DGuy]

See I'm not as sold on the insulation route. With a bathroom if your in an enclosed shower, you will feel colder when you come out what ever due to the temp difference.

Bath wise, by the time you have run the bath, the extra heat from the hot water will have heated the room up assuming the door is shut haha!

Just make sure you check all your measurements and fittings and such because if you go that route then find you are short on space it could make more problems!

The design for ours doing that wouldn't have been possible and ours is approx. 1.8m by 2m I think. Was a rather tight fit for the bath as it was once the boxing in for the Downpipe was finished. Had to slide in with practically no wiggle room!

Will be interested in the weight of those tiles. 2.6m x 3.3m is a pretty big bathroom! Have you got a floor plan or any photos?

 

[TheVictorian]

A warmer room means less condensation, which is more important in a bathroom than any other room in my opinion.

 

[liam546]

Both of you thanks again, it's much appreciated

I now know the tiles 90x45 are 25.24kg psqm.

The pic below is now gutted and back to lime mortar brick. There is an airing cupboard just out of sight on the right hand side.

Untitled

• liam546
• 26 Mar 2014
• 1

 

[3DGuy]

A warmer room means less condensation, which is more important in a bathroom than any other room in my opinion.

That's true, but on the flip side and just curious here. If the walls are warmer, so less condensation forms there. Isn't that going to then encourage/promote it to go elsewhere? Ie ceiling? Just wondering if you get all around condensation that's light rather than concentrating it?

I know the ceiling fan would be there but I've never seen one that can fully cope with steam from a shower, hence the run time after but I've never seen a bathroom condensation free.

Just wondering out loud really Always open to new ideas

 

[3DGuy]

Both of you thanks again, it's much appreciated

I now know the tiles 90x45 are 25.24kg psqm.

The pic below is now gutted and back to lime mortar brick. There is an airing cupboard just out of sight on the right hand side.

Untitled

• liam546
• 26 Mar 2014
• 1

So was this originally render and then plaster skim on top (you mentioned it was blown? If so this would have been about 2.5cm originally? So actually with MR board and Battens it would only be out what? 3.5cm more than originally? So proabablbly not make a huge difference. Alternatively what about 2x1 battons, using 25mm Celotex and then MR board? That will save another 2.5cm so it would only be out 1cm further than the original projection?

Remember the foam insulation is the equivalent of like 4-6x glass wool based insulation. so it would still offer about 100mm worth of insulation equivalent that used to be a roof standard. Just another option

 

[TheVictorian]

My ensuite is 1.6m x 1.6m with a decent extractor and no windows so no areas of cold bridging. It is also on the middle floor of a three storey house so no cold ceiling either. The door to the bedroom has about a 10mm gap between it and the floor, allowing air to flow from the bedroom to be extracted.

As a result of this I genuinely haven't experienced condensation anywhere other than the inside of the shower quadrant.

The room is only heated by a total of 200w of underfloor heating and that is really more for comfort underfoot than actually heating the room that much. There is also a 200w electric towel rail but that rarely gets turned on.

 

[liam546]

Spot on there, it was original lime tender and finish about 2.5cm thick and yes it was blown and coming away in places. I know on a decent plaster finish you the weight limit to hang tiles is 20kg psqm. So with my tiles being 25.24 kg psqm and plasterboard offering a weight limit of 30 kg psqm I was advised to hack all the plasterboard off and dot n dab. Although we've established that battens will be a better more long term secure solution.

My walls are every uneven with bricks jutting out in places. If I can get away with 2x1 battens and insulated with 25mm celotex then perhaps this would mean i would lose too much space as you suggested. I like this idea. I have already installed a powerful inline extraction fan that will sit in the loft space and the duct will be above or very near to the shower with the hope it takes away the steam from right above the shower. I was also thinking with plasterboard walls and not sand/cement for example the walls would be warmer and so wouldn't attract condensation. My next door neighbour went with a sand and cement finish and now they have cold walls and condensation problems.

 

[3DGuy]

My ensuite is 1.6m x 1.6m with a decent extractor and no windows so no areas of cold bridging. It is also on the middle floor of a three storey house so no cold ceiling either. The door to the bedroom has about a 10mm gap between it and the floor, allowing air to flow from the bedroom to be extracted.

As a result of this I genuinely haven't experienced condensation anywhere other than the inside of the shower quadrant.

The room is only heated by a total of 200w of underfloor heating and that is really more for comfort underfoot than actually heating the room that much. There is also a 200w electric towel rail but that rarely gets turned on.

Ahh right, yea I guess it depends on the layout setup etc. SOunds for your setup that was the best solution possible. Well thought of! Nice to know the full setup. Sounds nice Pics? Would be interested to see.

 

[3DGuy]

Spot on there, it was original lime tender and finish about 2.5cm thick and yes it was blown and coming away in places. I know on a decent plaster finish you the weight limit to hang tiles is 20kg psqm. So with my tiles being 25.24 kg psqm and plasterboard offering a weight limit of 30 kg psqm I was advised to hack all the plasterboard off and dot n dab. Although we've established that battens will be a better more long term secure solution.

My walls are every uneven with bricks jutting out in places. If I can get away with 2x1 battens and insulated with 25mm celotex then perhaps this would mean i would lose too much space as you suggested. I like this idea. I have already installed a powerful inline extraction fan that will sit in the loft space and the duct will be above or very near to the shower with the hope it takes away the steam from right above the shower. I was also thinking with plasterboard walls and not sand/cement for example the walls would be warmer and so wouldn't attract condensation. My next door neighbour went with a sand and cement finish and now they have cold walls and condensation problems.

Don't forget adhesive weight that 25kg sqm up to 32kgsqm will be smaller than you think. Yea I got out extractor very close to the shower area. We have a bath screen shower so I figured get it close to there. Inline roof type Nice and quiet too.

 

[liam546]

Perhaps I should be going for a tile backer board such as hardiebacker then as these can take up to 40 kg psqm. They are also water resistant and I could just tank the bit for additional resistance in the shower area.

 

[liam546]

Another question just popped into my head

If I go ahead fixing 2x1 battens to the wall and then fix MR plasterboard to these battens will I have enough depth in the batten to secure the board sufficiently?

If the batton is say 10mm deep and the board is 12.5mm it would mean id have to use quite short plasterboard screws. I'm used to using 42mm I think but if I use these I'll hit brick.

 

[liam546]

I've also checked the additional weight of the adhesive and grout and I'm told I should allow for 2-4kg psqm for this so with my 25.24kg tiles the total weight psqm shouldn't exceed 30kg psqm and the MR boards can take 32 kg psqm as you say

 

[3DGuy]

Another question just popped into my head

If I go ahead fixing 2x1 battens to the wall and then fix MR plasterboard to these battens will I have enough depth in the batten to secure the board sufficiently?

If the batton is say 10mm deep and the board is 12.5mm it would mean id have to use quite short plasterboard screws. I'm used to using 42mm I think but if I use these I'll hit brick.

2x1 is in inches it wont be 10mm it will be about 24mm. Planed batton timber is usually 24x44 (2x1) and 44x44mm (2x2)

Just make sure you get 32mm plasterboard Drywall Screws (12.5mm + 24 = 36.5mm)Room to spare hehe. I've used 52mm Drywall for 12.5mm to ceilings little OTT but hey ho

I used these - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRADE-ZIN...rial_Nails_Fixing_MJ&var=&hash=item7477390bb0


And remember the Bit they are brilliant.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-Drywall...Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item257d88de41

I've also checked the additional weight of the adhesive and grout and I'm told I should allow for 2-4kg psqm for this so with my 25.24kg tiles the total weight psqm shouldn't exceed 30kg psqm and the MR boards can take 32 kg psqm as you say

In my experience I take adhesive amounts with a pinch of salt if they think 2-4 I think 4-8 ha! But I'd have thought they would include a tolerance with that 32kgpsqm plus a bit more etc so people don't run right up to it so I'm sure you will be fine.