Irish EU referendum.

[Watchmaker]

"Ancient history is no reason to chuck our lot in with them"

Perhaps not, but, in my opinion, recent history is.

"Why can't we all live as trading neighbours and nothing else?"

We have tried it and, after the slaughter of twenty millions of Europeans in the lifetime of many more millions who are free today, again, it is my opinion that it is the only way.

 

[joe-90]

Rubbish. If 18 nations can live together without war then all the nations of the Earth can live together without war. If 18 of them can live together without war then conversely, they can all singly live side-by-side without war. It was the Germans on both occasions that started the last world wars. Stopping them rearming was all that was necessary. Maybe you can tell me why Yugoslavia couldn't live with itself after Tito?

 

[megawatt]

Does anybody think the tories would hold a referendum if they got in? F**k the lot of them, if I can ever be *rsed to vote again, it'll be for the national front.

The point is, if this Government sign us up to it there'll be nothing the Tories (or anyone else) will be able to do about it.

The way the whole constitution issue has been handled by Brussels, France and Germany (with Tony Blair and El Gordo trotting haplessly along behind) speaks volumes about everything that is currently wrong with the EU.

This is about Sovereignty, this is about us having the ability to govern ourselves on all the key issues that matter to us and this is fundamentally about our democratic right to choose ... Ireland were given the right to choose and they chose NO ... We were denied that fundamental right by our Government on the basis that ...

1. There is not significant constitutional change to warrant it.
2. The general public wouldn't understand it sufficiently to make the CORRECT choice.

Both of which are utter nonsense and simply highlight the devious and shambolic way we are being governed by El Gordo and co.

Politicians need to realise that democracy isn't a concept its a way of life and it cannot be ignored when it suits their cause or used as the justification for fighting unjust wars ... The people of this country aren't as daft as they seem to think ... As I'm sure El Gordo will realise after the next general election.

MW

 

[Shytalkz]

The people of this country aren't as daft as they seem to think ...

Oh I don't know, I would think that a substantial proportion could be classed as completely thick.

 

[holmslaw]

Found this on google, the article should have been titled how you change a majority vote into a unanimous vote.

In France, where the earlier EU constitution was strongly turned down by voters in 2005, the centre Right daily Le Figaro said in an editorial: "So far 18 countries have ratified the Lisbon treaty. As it would not be very democratic if three million Irish voters decide for 450 million Europeans, the only way out of the crisis is to pursue the ratification process in the hope that it will manage to reunite 26 countries out of 27. So that Europe can stay on track, so that it can have influence in a world in the midst of important change, it is going to be necessary to dedramatise the Irish 'no' and continue to steer towards the priorities of European politics. that is going to be the challenge of the French presidency."

 

[Shytalkz]

That says it all...

 

[Trazor]

If voting changed anything, they would make it illegal.

 

[roughcaster]

Most of the 450 million or so Europeans have have NOT decided to accept the EU Constitution (re-named: Lisbon Treaty), their Governments have decided that for them. They are all poodles to Brussels.

Roughcaster.

 

[Shytalkz]

Most of the 450 million or so Europeans have have NOT decided to accept the EU Constitution (re-named: Lisbon Treaty), their Governments have decided that for them. They are all poodles to Brussels.

Succinct, to the point and so 'kin' true.

 

[holmslaw]

Most of the 450 million or so Europeans have have NOT decided to accept the EU Constitution (re-named: Lisbon Treaty), their Governments have decided that for them. They are all poodles to Brussels.

Roughcaster.

You'll will never hear any politician say that or anything remotely like it.

 

[Shytalkz]

No, they use weasel words to infer that we, the great unwashed, are not fit to take any part in the decision-making process. Means the same thing though.

 

[sooey]

"Ancient history is no reason to chuck our lot in with them"

Perhaps not, but, in my opinion, recent history is.

"Why can't we all live as trading neighbours and nothing else?"

We have tried it and, after the slaughter of twenty millions of Europeans in the lifetime of many more millions who are free today, again, it is my opinion that it is the only way.

If history teaches anything about this, it's that treaties, like rules are made to be broken. As soon as it's deemed in the national interest for a country or countries to leave the EU these treaties won't stop it happening.
Besides, lumping different peoples together under one flag hasn't worked in many places in Africa, Yugoslavia, Iraq to name a few. Why should this be any different.

 

[joe-90]

Because we've dumped all nationalities together in the good old UK - and it's been a resounding success hasn't it?

 

[Shytalkz]

Be still my beating heart - my views have touched base with Joe's

 

[billyo]

joe i though the scotts and half the northern irish want to go on without the uk flag