Is it time to bring out our Special Forces?

[^woody^]

if the aggressors took hostages

And what are the chances of that?

It will be all over as soon as the magazines are emptied and the vest detonated.

 

[terrypin]

Mali, 170 hostages.
Moscow. 2002, 850 hostages.
Beslam 2004, 350+ hostages.

The list is long.
Every single attack carries a risk of a hostage situation becoming real. Not every terrorist is on a suicide mission so what if their escape is hindered and there's a few members of the public near by........hostages.

What if they want TV coverage to air their grievances?

We've taken our eye off the ball somewhat, there's more out there, other thanISIS, probably about 50 organisations that are a threat to us, just waiting for their time.

 

[JBR]

I can't understand why that copper said what he said publicly. He might as well have said " Dear terrorist, don't attack London, attack another city, they're not defended, you'll kill far more people". Bizarre. Maybe he lives in London. The rotten swine.

I think it was Surrey's PCC that said it not a copper.

Typical.
What the hell use are PCCs? How many useful coppers could you get for their salaries?

 

[HawkEye244]

To be honest why not cut to the chase with what the government really wants, a CCTV camera in every bedroom/sh1tter, and a microchip in every person. Why else would they flood the european countries with these migrants, they knew some of them would do this, how could they not have. Seems like a deliberate ploy to keep the general public on the fear cycle. Imagine what life was like before 9/11, a completely different era almost, and a nicer one. Peace always returns eventually though but for how long.

You are of course joking. Microchip a RoP

Handy you laugh but we live in a surveillance society. Look at the landscape now of your average highstreet, cameras on every courner, shopping centres phasing in facial recognition, where's it all headed? They have passed legislation to make it mandatory to microchip dogs from 2016 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-21345730, the RSPCA say it's unecessary and won't solve the problem of stray dogs, so why are they doing it? Well one reason would be to help the police to prosecute owners who allow their dogs to attack people on their own property, ... on their own property... Is it unfathomable that they pass legislation that mandates microchipping a child using the usual fear tactics? As though somehow that whole biological/evolutionary step can be contracted out to the government. Since when do we need people telling us how to raise our children or look after our pets? I'm not joking at all. What does RoP mean by the way ?

 

[WalksWithTurkeys]

RoP means 'Religion of Peace', it is a derogatory term for Islam.

 

[bernardgreen]

Since when do we need people telling us how to raise our children or look after our pets?

Looking at the anti-social behaviour of some of today's children there is a need for some parents to be told how to bring up their children.

 

[JBR]

I strongly agree with surveillance cameras. If you have nothing to hide, what possible objection could there be? I feel safer walking through 'rough' areas if I see cameras and I believe they serve a useful service with regard to safety and combating crime.

As for microchipping people, I'm not so sure. I'd like to know what information such chips would contain, for a start, and the purpose they would serve. I can see a possible use in the case of criminals, just as 'tags' attached to their legs are currently used. They would be rather more difficult to remove, although not impossible of course.

 

[joe-90]

If someone had been to Syria to train in Jihad, then micro-chipping should be the norm.

 

[mikeey84]

Following the recent terrorist atrocities it proves no country is safe from these fanatics.

One of our police chiefs has admitted we are vulnerable and little equipped to deal with events like happened in Paris.

This got me thinking, how would we deal with an attack on somewhere like the Trafford Centre, for instance?

The response would be little more than useless, our Aremed Response teams are few and far between with little or no training in hostage rescue and tactical breaches and certainly not close-quarter battles.

The attackers would have free reign for hours before any sort of half decent option was available and even hours more before a breach/assault could even be considered as possible.

I think it's time we utilised our special forces, strategically positioned up and down the country where they could respond within the hour(?).

They are all trained in hostage release situations and all natures of tactical breaches/assaults, this is what the train for and we are at war with an invisible army, we need to use them before it's too late and that's not far off, imho.

As the crow flies, its about 95 miles from Hereford to the Trafford Centre.

A Merlin helicopter can fly at over 180mph.

Given that I imagine there is a "go" team at Hereford ready in case something like this happens, I imagine SAS could be at the Trafford center within the hour of the alarm being raised.

 

[terrypin]

Very optimistic, improbable if not impossible.

The Trafford Centre was a mere example so the location and proximity to Hereford is irrelevant.
It could happen anywhere.

 

[WalksWithTurkeys]

Following the recent terrorist atrocities it proves no country is safe from these fanatics.

One of our police chiefs has admitted we are vulnerable and little equipped to deal with events like happened in Paris.

This got me thinking, how would we deal with an attack on somewhere like the Trafford Centre, for instance?

The response would be little more than useless, our Aremed Response teams are few and far between with little or no training in hostage rescue and tactical breaches and certainly not close-quarter battles.

The attackers would have free reign for hours before any sort of half decent option was available and even hours more before a breach/assault could even be considered as possible.

I think it's time we utilised our special forces, strategically positioned up and down the country where they could respond within the hour(?).

They are all trained in hostage release situations and all natures of tactical breaches/assaults, this is what the train for and we are at war with an invisible army, we need to use them before it's too late and that's not far off, imho.

As the crow flies, its about 95 miles from Hereford to the Trafford Centre.

A Merlin helicopter can fly at over 180mph.

Given that I imagine there is a "go" team at Hereford ready in case something like this happens, I imagine SAS could be at the Trafford center within the hour of the alarm being raised.

Allow time for reports to come through to the police, then allow time for senior staff to be alerted, then allow time to alert the higher authorities, helicopter scramble time, time to locate a landing site, and to get from there to the target site, they won't be on site under an hour, probably a lot more. Is there a hot line from top local copper to the SAS? Anyway, would the jihadists have ammunition to last an hour?

I think the truth is that a dedicated group of armed nut jobs could easily kill 100 people, at a concert, when football fans leave the ground etc. They could wipe out a school of children, they probably are that sick.

 

[mikeey84]

Following the recent terrorist atrocities it proves no country is safe from these fanatics.

One of our police chiefs has admitted we are vulnerable and little equipped to deal with events like happened in Paris.

This got me thinking, how would we deal with an attack on somewhere like the Trafford Centre, for instance?

The response would be little more than useless, our Aremed Response teams are few and far between with little or no training in hostage rescue and tactical breaches and certainly not close-quarter battles.

The attackers would have free reign for hours before any sort of half decent option was available and even hours more before a breach/assault could even be considered as possible.

I think it's time we utilised our special forces, strategically positioned up and down the country where they could respond within the hour(?).

They are all trained in hostage release situations and all natures of tactical breaches/assaults, this is what the train for and we are at war with an invisible army, we need to use them before it's too late and that's not far off, imho.

As the crow flies, its about 95 miles from Hereford to the Trafford Centre.

A Merlin helicopter can fly at over 180mph.

Given that I imagine there is a "go" team at Hereford ready in case something like this happens, I imagine SAS could be at the Trafford center within the hour of the alarm being raised.

Allow time for reports to come through to the police, then allow time for senior staff to be alerted, then allow time to alert the higher authorities, helicopter scramble time, time to locate a landing site, and to get from there to the target site, they won't be on site under an hour, probably a lot more. Is there a hot line from top local copper to the SAS? Anyway, would the jihadists have ammunition to last an hour?

I think the truth is that a dedicated group of armed nut jobs could easily kill 100 people, at a concert, when football fans leave the ground etc. They could wipe out a school of children, they probably are that sick.

I am pretty sure the SAS will have helicopters at Hereford for just such an occurrence
Each major metropolitan force will have a senior anti terror commander, who will, one imagines, have a direct line to the Director Special Forces, who would be in overall command on the ground.
I imagine for each major site in the UK (shopping centers, stadiums etc) there are contingency plans in place which have identified landing sites, exfil routes etc.

Am I saying that this will stop a massacre? Of course not, unless there is a SF group on the ground IN the shopping center/school/concert (for example), there is no way of preventing a bunch of terrorists from shooting/blowing themselves up.

As to the original point, given what has happened recently, Paris, Mumbai etc, I am pretty sure there are plans in place for responses. Its likely that if anything does kick off, it will be in one of half a dozen or so cities across the UK, and I would put good money on at least a small force of SF troops are in garrison close to those cities at the moment.

 

[mikeey84]

Very optimistic, improbable if not impossible.

The Trafford Centre was a mere example so the location and proximity to Hereford is irrelevant.
It could happen anywhere.

Its unlikely to happen ANYWHERE.

I doubt ISIS will rock up at Grantham Town vs Nuneaton Bourough at the Meres Stadium next Saturday, or mow down shoppers in the Clocktowers shopping center in Rugby, or a folk concert in Scarborough.

London, Manchester, Birmingham, Leeds, Glasgow, Edinburgh, Cardiff (with apologies to Newcastle, Sheffield, Nottingham and Liverpool) are by quite a distance the most likely targets, and there are SF within an hour or so of pretty much all of those locations.

 

[terrypin]

Thank you, that's put my mind at rest, knowing any would-be attackers would be so predictable.

Bless em.

 

[mikeey84]

Thank you, that's put my mind at rest, knowing any would-be attackers would be so predictable.

Bless em.

Oh grow up. Mumbai- one of the largest cities in the world, Paris- capital of France, Brussels- capital of Belgium London tube bombings, 9/11 etc
Why the hell would they strike somewhere that isn't high profile?