Israel under attack

So we have moved onto bombing churches now.

It says a building next door was destroyed 2 killed, and a church wall was damaged and Israel admitted this unlike your false claims earlier this week about the Israelis hospital car park blast which claimed many hundreds of lives.
 
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Clearly different websites with different addresses.

Which matches, exactly, the actual Hamas website document. You are all over the place on this.
You don't understand.
The Wikipedia site refers one to the MEE site. Your other link was dierect to the MEE site. i.e. both the same sites. It's just that one was via Wikipedia, and the other was direct. Furthermore the MEE site is a London based, UK reporters who can only operate withoin the limits of UK restrictions.

You and I cannot access directly the Hamas website. What you see what you think is a Hamas website, is really an archived version.
We don't if that archived website is a genuine version of the Hamas website. We can't even be sure that Hamas have a website.
Israel has form for cyber warfare. (see my previous presentations on MEE cyber attack) Why do yoiu think Hamas would not be targetted?
The nearest that you can get to a Hamas website are references to Hamas on Israeli and US websites.

You are confused on this.
 
So we have moved onto bombing churches now.

Well, religion is at the heart of this conflict to start with.
 
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You are repeating nonsense. You dispute the version of the charter I have posted from different sources and then you go on to mention it yourself. When queried what charter you are referring to it turns out to be the one I posted.

Make your mind up.
My mind is quite clear.
Let me deal with your points one at a time, which I've already dealt with before, which proves you don't read my comments.

You are repeating nonsense. You dispute the version of the charter I have posted from different sources and then you go on to mention it yourself.
I'm not disputing the version of what you present, what I am saying, and what you are not understanding, is that these versions are the output of Israel, US and UK sources. Therefore they cannnot be relied on to be accurate. I've already discussed this.
I've previously mentioned how the translation of the bible produces many versions. When I'm translating English to French and vce versa, there are many options, many words to choose from. I did mention just the other day, where 'âme'' was translated as 'heart', but I would have translated it as 'soul' A few words here, a few words there can change the whole sentiment of the document.

I suspect that the MEE version is also from the Israel/US version.
So I can't say the version that is circulated in the west is wrong. We don't know because we can't access the original, or even a reliable translated version..
So stop confusing yourself and accept that the internet is awash with misinformation. Why do you think a Hamas document would not be affected?
When queried what charter you are referring to it turns out to be the one I posted.
Because it's the only one we can access, it's the only one available in English, so we have to work with that one.
Now do you understand?

You haven't (you claim). Therefore you cannot claim to know what the aims of Hamas are.
I have worked with the only version that we can access, and deduced from that version what Hamas's aims with that charter are.
You claimed they were contradictory. I clarified it for you and showed how they are not necessarily contradictory. Perhaps you don't remember or never read it.
I mentioned the situation of American indigenous people living in (nearly) harmony with white and non-white descendants of immigrants.
I also mentioned Canadians/Alaskans living side by side with Inuits. (perhaps you remember that discussion?)
I'm sure there's many more examples, e.g the multi-national international aspects of places like Hong Kong,
So different ethnicities can live side by side in peace.
That is what the Hamas charter (the only one we can access) is suggesting.
I'll repeat it here for you. I do find I have to repeat myself often. :rolleyes:

The Hamas charter (the only one we can access) suggests the whole of Israel being available for Palestinians and Israelis to live side by side in peace and relative harmony. And the UN resolution as far as Jerusalem is concenred is for it to be respected, i.e equally shared.
The one bone of contention would be that Palestinians don't recognise Israel as a state. It was created by forcibly taking the land from Palestinians.

In comparison, Israel would accept Palestinians living side by side with Israelis in peace and harmony, except that the Israel Declaration allows for apartheid to be legally applied. That would exclude Palestinians from any government, and make them second class citizens.

The real problem is the propganda and misinformation put out by various sources, e.g Israelis argue that Hamas want Israel off the face of the earth, and Hamas argue that the Zionists among the Israelis want Palestinians off the face of the earth.

Hamas does wnat the state of Israel to be dismantled and replaced by a Palestinian state. But it does not exclude Israelis from continued living in peace and harmony in Palestine.

Does that clarify it for you, albeit it is my understanding of the only version of the Hamas charter that we can access.
 
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So we have moved onto bombing churches now.


Depends who is in there to a certain extent

And what the church is being used for ??
 
The Wikipedia site refers one to the MEE site. Your other link was dierect to the MEE site. i.e. both the same sites.
No,

This is one,

https://irp.fas.org/world/para/docs/hamas-2017.pdf

This is the other,

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/hamas-2017-document-full

Exactly the same document from different sites.
You and I cannot access directly the Hamas website.
Yes you can. Use a vpn and access the official english translation on the official Hamas website.

It is exactly the same as the two I linked to.

If you think it is all fake then I can't help you. If you think it is all fake then it reinforces my point that you have no idea what Hamas actually stand for.
 
'Hamas Media Office' provides a link to 'Palestine Watch' which unfolds 11 pages of Hamas declarations.

Principles and Policies

You can find more information/propaganda under 'Hamas Press Office', and i wonder if they've taken a similar course of media studies that the Taliban employed in the past ten years, before retaking Afghanistan: promising they'd behave and adopted a more conciliatory tone before unveiling the real agenda once in power.

IF a two-state solution was ever resolved can you imagine what it'd look like?
A heavily militarised DMZ with a police state at one end and an Islamic Republic at the other, perhaps.
The Hamas Media Office presented by Denso is a US website.
The PMW Palestine Media Watch is US website
Look at the Telephone code for contact:
1697804537504.png

It's Dallas.
1697804636333.png
 
No,

This is one,

https://irp.fas.org/world/para/docs/hamas-2017.pdf

This is the other,

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/hamas-2017-document-full

Exactly the same document from different sites.

Yes you can. Use a vpn and access the official english translation on the official Hamas website.

It is exactly the same as the two I linked to.

If you think it is all fake then I can't help you. If you think it is all fake then it reinforces my point that you have no idea what Hamas actually stand for.
We've already done this, several times now.
The first link is to a US website. It's a US Intelligence website. Use just the first part of the link: https://irp.fas.org
The rest of that link is just to a document on that site.

The other is to MEE, which is exactly the same one that Wikipedia refers to.

If both versions are exactly the same, we can deduce that we are all working form the US version, a US Intelligence version.

And we knw that US is not a relablke independent actor in this issue.
 
No you can't. It is the same as on the Hams website. But I get it, the website could be fake.
The Hamas Media Office obviously is. The PMW obvioulsy is.
They are both US websites. Maybe Hamas is operating out of Dallas, USA. :rolleyes:
Israel is involved in cyberwarfare also. We know that from the MEE website.
 
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