Landis & Gyr 5235a -How to download data on FRAM

[davidc1500]

Hello Recently had E.ON Next fit one of these 100amp meters into our home on 19th April. They are now claiming that up to 30th May we have consumed 18,286kwh of electricity ! Our normal daily rate is on average 8kwh per day for the last 20 years. Is there any way to access the software to download the data on the meter as what they are doing to us is criminal. I can show that in the space of 15 days the meter was reading 17,164kwh which works out to be 1,134kwh per day !! Any help I would be extremely grateful for.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Hello Recently had E.ON Next fit one of these 100amp meters into our home on 19th April. They are now claiming that up to 30th May we have consumed 18,286kwh of electricity ! Our normal daily rate is on average 8kwh per day for the last 20 years. Is there any way to access the software to download the data on the meter as what they are doing to us is criminal. I can show that in the space of 15 days the meter was reading 17,164kwh which works out to be 1,134kwh per day !! Any help I would be extremely grateful for.

8x 40days = 320Kwh, so something wildly amiss!

I would suggest the installer, misread the numbers on the meter, when (s)he initially installed it. They usually ask you to witness the numbers, and sign a card to confirm the numbers, did they?

Is this a smart meter?

A Smart Meter will send it's readings and consumption data, to your supplier, and you can then check the consumption figures. You also get an In Home Display, which shows you how much you are using constantly.

Other than that, modern meters have a flashing LED, counting the flashes, give an accurate indication of consumption. You can also get a clip on ammeter, which will give an instantaneous reading of consumption.

There is no way for you to directly access the meter, to investigate the software, other than regularly logging the meter reading. Have you tried logging the reading daily?

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Meter manual here - https://www.solartradesales.co.uk/Cache/Downloads/L-and-G-5235-User-ManualBrochure-info.pdf

 

[davidc1500]

Thanks Harry. No it is not a smart meter. No they did not get me to witness it or sign anything and they omitted to put the opening reading on the card next to the meter. They are doing this deliberately as we had no legally binding contract with them and we have evidence of them creating fraudulent documentation to hold a bill of over £11,000 against us. They are committing fraud. Pure and simple. They also force fitted a gas smart meter against our wishes. Totally corrupt company.

 

[Rodders53]

I would suggest the installer, misread the numbers on the meter, when (s)he initially installed it. They usually ask you to witness the numbers, and sign a card to confirm the numbers, did they?

Neither the swap of faulty (stuck display) meter by EoN for a dumb one, nor the more recent swap to a smart meter required me to witness or sign anything.
They did affix cards on to the meter back panel in the external meter box with old and new readings in both cases.

Naturally I'd taken pics of before and after in both instances. I assume the OP did, too?

Likely by moving into a property the OP has entered into a 'deemed contract' with the incumbent supplier EoN? OP needs to seek Legal Advice (via house insurance) and go the energy Ombudsman route as well if the complaints process has been exhausted / reached deadlock?

EoN's meter changer probably has electronic records and pictures taken... ask for copies of those?

The basic 'turn everything off' and monitor the meter reading(s) should be done (if not done already)... some installs now have an isolator between meter and consumer unit to do that easier... Nothing on means meter should not increment and the red light will, after a period, go steady red. {It's the fault mine had}.

Similarly switch off unplug all unnecessary circuits and appliances in case something is eating electric (electric UFH, immersion heaters, pond pumps, hot tubs, pools).

Another step might be to get EoN to install a check meter?

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Neither the swap of faulty (stuck display) meter by EoN for a dumb one, nor the more recent swap to a smart meter required me to witness or sign anything.
They did affix cards on to the meter back panel in the external meter box with old and new readings in both cases.

Well, they are required to do so. Both of my meters, have a label stuck on them, bearing my signature following the meter swap.

Thanks Harry. No it is not a smart meter. No they did not get me to witness it or sign anything and they omitted to put the opening reading on the card next to the meter. They are doing this deliberately as we had no legally binding contract with them and we have evidence of them creating fraudulent documentation to hold a bill of over £11,000 against us.

I would doubt there is a deliberate fraud going on, rather a simple accounting mistake.

So, you have a new electric meter, which has been in for 1 1/2 months. How have EON been able to obtain the meter readings, to work out your consumption? They don't normally send a meter reader out every month....

They also force fitted a gas smart meter against our wishes.

There would be absolutely no point in fitting a smart gas meter, without fitting a smart electric meter, because the gas will not work, without the electric meter.

 

[Rodders53]

Well, they are required to do so. Both of my meters, have a label stuck on them, bearing my signature following the meter swap

Link to the Legislation, please (or even a Code of Practice which won't be binding).

Twice in roughly 6 months is my recent experience with EoN. When was yours and which supplier(s)?

Mind they do some strange things Up North cf Dahn Sowf.

There would be absolutely no point in fitting a smart gas meter, without fitting a smart electric meter, because the gas will not work, without the electric meter.

Maybe there were no dumb gas meters available for fitting? But it does seem very strange for a supplier to do?

 

[IT Minion]

Hello Recently had E.ON Next fit one of these 100amp meters into our home on 19th April. They are now claiming that up to 30th May we have consumed 18,286kwh of electricity ! Our normal daily rate is on average 8kwh per day for the last 20 years. Is there any way to access the software to download the data on the meter as what they are doing to us is criminal. I can show that in the space of 15 days the meter was reading 17,164kwh which works out to be 1,134kwh per day !! Any help I would be extremely grateful for.

Isn't this technically impossible?

1134 kWh a day is around 48kW average. A 100 amp supply should only be able to provide half that (24kW @ 240v) Running 200 amps through the fuse wouldn't go well for the fuse.

The fact it's showing twice the maximum supply also smells fishy.

Have you tried turning off the distribution board and seeing if the numbers keep climbing?

 

[Rodders53]

Isn't this technically impossible? 1134 kWh a day is around 48kW average. A 100 amp supply should only be able to provide half that (24kW @ 240v) Running 200 amps through the fuse wouldn't go well for the fuse.

I make 18,286 kWh / 41 days (30 may 11 april) to be 446 kWh per day. (A tad under 20kW all the time). Times 4 Amps, per kW, and divide by 24 hours = 74.3 Amps... continuously. Which might not rupture a suitable DNO fuse (80/100 A).

But yes the OPs other statement wrt a 15 day period is not feasible with a domestic fuse rating. If 100 A it'd blow within a few minutes with that sort of load and sooner for a lower fuse rating.

Has the OP been daft enough to send readings in including the two digits after the decimal point --- so rather than 001234(.56) have entered 123456 in their meter reads???

If so EoN need correcting with photos of meter... and it's circa 183 kWh in 41 days or 4.46 kWh per day which is relatively low but perfectly believable?

EDIT: The decimal point is not always that readily visible. It has caught others, on MSE Energy forums, out before!!

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

Twice in roughly 6 months is my recent experience with EoN. When was yours and which supplier(s)?

I've had two or three sets of SM's, due to swapping suppliers, and each time they asked me to sign a slip, to confirm the old/new meter readings..

 

[davidc1500]

The meter in question was manufactured in May 2012 and has a label on it saying that is was "recycled" in September 2023. I understand that energy companies are not supposed to use meters that are over 10 years old. E.ON have not supplied any photographic evidence of the opening reading so hence the doubt about their honesty. Please see attached picture of the meter of E.ON's which was taken out and replaced with our own due on the 5th May due to the doubt of their practices. I think that it clearly shows 17,164kwh unless I am mistaken. Also they have sent the reading to our new supplier the figure of 18,286 stating that is what they state is genuine hence us challenging them on this ridiculous figure.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

I understand that energy companies are not supposed to use meters that are over 10 years old.

No, the rule is the calibration is supposed to be checked, every 10 years. If they pass, then they can be reissued. Often they do go unchecked, for many decades.

 

[IT Minion]

This is the user manual for your meter I believe.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.solartradesales.co.uk/Cache/Downloads/L-and-G-5235-User-ManualBrochure-info.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwin9fSb2seGAxWFTkEAHQfSDqcQFnoECCQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw20mA2r8v-tYGjivwhtau9H

the normal display mode shows energy use to two decimal places. I think @Rodders53 called it right, you have used only 171kWh in the photo you posted.

 

[Harry Bloomfield]

This is the user manual for your meter I believe.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.solartradesales.co.uk/Cache/Downloads/L-and-G-5235-User-ManualBrochure-info.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwin9fSb2seGAxWFTkEAHQfSDqcQFnoECCQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw20mA2r8v-tYGjivwhtau9H

the normal display mode shows energy use to two decimal places. I think @Rodders53 called it right, you have used only 171kWh in the photo you posted.

I cannot see a decimal point, in the OP's photo of his meter, but yes, according to the manual, the rightmost pair of digits, follow a decimal point. Hence 171Kwh it is..

 

[davidc1500]

Many thanks for all your help.
As you can see there is no decimal point in the reading. I submitted 171.64 to our new supplier EDF and E.ON came back with 18,268 kwh challenge. Also see attached picture of the meter tag where E.ON omitted to put in the opening reading on 19th April. They put in the opening reading for the gas meter tag. Another mistake ? Would I be able to argue in court that the figure of 17,164 is just 171.64 when there clearly is no decimal point ? The manual clearly shows decimal point in its readings.This is my concern.