Life in 2020

[empip]

Well, there we go ... It could be as stark as this ....
http://www.est.org.uk/aboutest/news/pressreleases/index.cfm?mode=view&press_id=443

In the event, I guess there'd be so many trying to emigrate ... that path would close down ... Back will come border controls to keep us IN !!

 

[Steve]

i have only scaned thru it, but that is bleak. I do like the idea of the personal power station though - everyone produces their own power through renewable sources, with a battery backup for high demand like showers and cooking.

 

[andy]

just quickly looked thru it and this got my attention

Empty driveways - the two-car family could become unheard of as fuel prices rocket and personal vehicle use is heavily rationed

now why dont the government take away tax on veggie oil, then more people would be willing to mix it with diesel, and then the diesel useage could drop by half. but then so would the governments profits, so thats never gonna happen. after all, money is everything for them

 

[WoodYouLike]

What I miss in this report (and in most reports about this subject come to think of it) is the needed response of energy wasting and heavily polluting industries!

It's the same with waste, it's always about how we 'produce' so much waste! Well, sorry, I don't 'produce' waste, that's up to manufacturers packiging strategy (everything seems to be in double packing: plastic, non-breakable tothtpaste tubes in a carton box, plastic bags for every purchace you make!)

Why has it always has to be down to the 'innocent' consumer to change his/her habits?

Rant over

 

[oilman]

.............
Why has it always has to be down to the 'innocent' consumer to change his/her habits?

It's often those habits which keep the system running after the initial start up by others. I used to have a push lawn mower, how many people do you know with one? I have a motor mower now, but I often trim it with a scythe .

Look at the crap that is advertised for Christmas toy gifts now, loads of plactic (look out for joe) all derived from oil. How long will it last? A lot of it is for "games". You just don't need all the gadgets for games, imagination and a few pieces of paper or card would do.

How often do people replace, (er, sorry, upgrade) their mobile phone?

This could go on for ever.....................

 

[WoodYouLike]

Yes I know Oilman, but I'm getting a bit sick and tiered that the change to the environment has to be down ONLY by consumers and the polluting industry isn't even mentioned.

 

[joe-90]

No one has mentioned the biggest threat to our lives.

We live in a world of intensive farming. Without it we would starve.
Intensive farming means fertilizers. Do you know where we get our fertilizers from? I'll give you one guess.

This is also the reason that growing vegetable oil for fuel is a waste of time.

It takes more oil energy to produce vegetable oil than is used in the production process - you may just as well use the oil you already have.

Do a search on 'Peak oil' if you want to know what is going on.

Here's a good starting point: http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/


joe

 

[oilman]

Ssshhhhh!!!! The governments don't want people to know this, or this . Makes DIYnot discussions look really amateurish.[/url]

 

[Freddie]

No one has mentioned the biggest threat to our lives.

We live in a world of intensive farming. Without it we would starve.
Intensive farming means fertilizers. Do you know where we get our fertilizers from? I'll give you one guess.

This is also the reason that growing vegetable oil for fuel is a waste of time.

It takes more oil energy to produce vegetable oil than is used in the production process - you may just as well use the oil you already have.

Do a search on 'Peak oil' if you want to know what is going on.

Here's a good starting point: http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/


joe

Actually Joe + Oilman on that subject-------

I think around 75% of the nitrogen fertiliser put on crops is wasted as it gets washed away and never gets chance to be taken up by the crops.

The best fertiliser is slow release which one of is cow manure made with straw but animals are rarely kept on straw today so this kind of manure is rare.

Of course it is easy to make slow release man made manure but then they wouldnt sell as much would they?

At the end of the day fertiliser is applied to crops to make them grow faster and cheaper so you the consumer can have cheap food.

Shops do have more enviroment friendly food for sale but with all the shouting about who is destroying the enviroment the shoppers time and time again shun any other food and always buy the cheapest and most un-enviroment friendly food.

Dare i say you reap what you sow

 

[petewood]

now why dont the government take away tax on veggie oil,

why doesn't the government treble the tax on diesel and petrol and invest the extra revenue in developing alternative energy sources at the same time as reducing reliance on fossil fuels?

 

[petewood]

Shops do have more enviroment friendly food for sale but with all the shouting about who is destroying the enviroment the shoppers time and time again shun any other food and always buy the cheapest and most un-enviroment friendly food.

I don't think this is true. Sales of organic and free-trade food are increasing year-on-year even though they are more expensive.

 

[joe-90]

why doesn't the government treble the tax on diesel and petrol and invest the extra revenue in developing alternative energy sources at the same time as reducing reliance on fossil fuels?

Because there aren't any realistic alternatives. Oil is free energy - nothing else can compete with that.




joe

 

[andy]

now why dont the government take away tax on veggie oil,

why doesn't the government treble the tax on diesel and petrol and invest the extra revenue in developing alternative energy sources at the same time as reducing reliance on fossil fuels?

because any rise in tax would go to them and not what its suposed to. for most people, mixing diesel 50/50 would half the diesel useage. for other vehicles that make longer (time) journeys, i.e trucks/delivery vans etc they could run on pretty much 100% veggie oil, with only diesel being used until the engine/veggie oil is warmer. fair enough it could cost quite a bit to convert the vehicles, but it wouldnt take long to see the profits from using less diesel. then again, the government would then slap 80P/litre tax on veggie oil

 

[petewood]

. Oil is free energy - nothing else can compete with that.

I have never been rude to anyone on this forum but that comment sorely tempts me to break that rule. How can you say that oil is free energy when A. it costs $60 per barrel to buy
B. The costs to the environment and to your future of burning oil have not even begun to be paid.

 

[petewood]

now why dont the government take away tax on veggie oil,

why doesn't the government treble the tax on diesel and petrol and invest the extra revenue in developing alternative energy sources at the same time as reducing reliance on fossil fuels?

because any rise in tax would go to them and not what its suposed to. for most people, mixing diesel 50/50 would half the diesel useage. for other vehicles that make longer (time) journeys, i.e trucks/delivery vans etc they could run on pretty much 100% veggie oil, with only diesel being used until the engine/veggie oil is warmer. fair enough it could cost quite a bit to convert the vehicles, but it wouldnt take long to see the profits from using less diesel. then again, the government would then slap 80P/litre tax on veggie oil

It would be far better for us to start driving less than to think of new ways to eke out our dwindling resources.

Would it be better to tax road-miles than fuel usage to encourage a greater degree of self- and local-sufficiency?