Query regarding Amendment 3, 2015 to the Wiring Regulations (England)

[ban-all-sheds]

But back to the plot.

Either the electrician does not know what he's talking about or he's trying to scam extra work out of the OP.

Unless anybody can suggest another "or..." I suggest Max thanks him for his quote and has no more to do with him.

 

[JohnW2]

Didn't I just say they should have referred to existing standards?

You did, and I'm agreeing with you. You said that you have someone looking into the possibility that there are Standards which define 'non-combustible', but I was adding the point that, even is such proves to be the case, it means little in terms of BS7671 in the absence of a reference to that other Standard.

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

...it means little in terms of BS7671 in the absence of a reference to that other Standard unless a significant number of people act as if "non-combustible material" is satisfied by a recognised standard for combustibility which applies to building materials.

 

[Risteard]

and only if you replace the unit.

I don't agree. It would not be permissible to connect into a combustible domestic DB from next year.

 

[davelx]

and only if you replace the unit.

I don't agree. It would not be permissible to connect into a combustible domestic DB from next year.

If that is really the case, then the amount of work, other than rewires, that domestic electricians are going to get is going to drop through the floor and the amount of non-notified DIY work is going to go through the ceiling, as people are simply NOT going to pay for a new CU just to have a single new circuit installed where there is plenty of capacity in the existing CU.

 

[stillp]

it means little in terms of BS7671 in the absence of a reference to that other Standard.

Kind Regards, John

It could be referred to in a certificate by an installer to demonstrate how they had complied with the requirement in 7671.

 

[JohnW2]

it means little in terms of BS7671 in the absence of a reference to that other Standard.

It could be referred to in a certificate by an installer to demonstrate how they had complied with the requirement in 7671.

It could, but in the absence of a crystal ball and the absence of any clarity in BS7671, there could be no certainty that compliance with that other Standard would satisfy whatever requirement BS7671 is trying to impose.

Of course, a lot will depend upon what you discover about how what that 'other Standard' requires (for a 'non-combustible' material) compares with what is required for compliance with BS EN 61439-3. Can you remind us what the latter requires in terms of 'combustibility'?

Kind Regards, John

 

[ban-all-sheds]

It would not be permissible to connect into a combustible domestic DB from next year.

In my time here I have read an awful lot of ridiculous things posted by the stupid and the ignorant. It shows no sign of stopping.

 

[ban-all-sheds]

It could, but in the absence of a crystal ball and the absence of any clarity in BS7671, there could be no certainty that compliance with that other Standard would satisfy whatever requirement BS7671 is trying to impose.

Of course, a lot will depend upon what you discover about how what that 'other Standard' requires (for a 'non-combustible' material) compares with what is required for compliance with BS EN 61439-3. Can you remind us what the latter requires in terms of 'combustibility'?

If stillp finds that there is a relevant standard which defines "non-combustible" then the absence of any "clarity" (aka requirements to the contrary) guarantees that it would be compliant with BS 7671.

 

[PBC_1966]

I don't agree. It would not be permissible to connect into a combustible domestic DB from next year.

Why not?

 

[JohnW2]

If stillp finds that there is a relevant standard which defines "non-combustible" then the absence of any "clarity" (aka requirements to the contrary) guarantees that it would be compliant with BS 7671.

That's surely the point - or, at least, the point I was trying to make. If (as he seemed to be suggesting is possible) stillp finds a Standard relating to, say, structural building materials which defines 'non-combustible' (in that context), who is to say that that Standard (and definition) is relevant to BS7671?

Kind Regards, John

 

[EFLImpudence]

I don't agree. It would not be permissible to connect into a combustible domestic DB from next year.

Why not?

Please can you fit a socket in the cupboard under the CU.

Certainly, but you will need a new CU - £600 please.

 

[PBC_1966]

Please can you fit a socket in the cupboard under the CU.

Certainly, but you will need a new CU - £600 please.

Precisely! Go down that route and you might as well say that you can't replace a light switch unless the entire house is brought to the current edition of BS7671!

 

[ban-all-sheds]

That's surely the point - or, at least, the point I was trying to make. If (as he seemed to be suggesting is possible) stillp finds a Standard relating to, say, structural building materials which defines 'non-combustible' (in that context), who is to say that that Standard (and definition) is relevant to BS7671?

Of course it is relevant to BS 7671 if it applies to materials used in buildings. They don't have to be structural - they could be decorative, or functional non-structural. I can immediately think of several uses of materials in buildings where flammability standards might well exist (indeed should exist, for example ventilation ducts).

 

[JohnW2]

Of course it is relevant to BS 7671 if it applies to materials used in buildings. They don't have to be structural - they could be decorative, or functional non-structural. I can immediately think of several uses of materials in buildings where flammability standards might well exist (indeed should exist, for example ventilation ducts).

All true, but that still does not mean that a definition of 'non-combustible' in the context of, say, ventilation ducts is necessarily relevant to electrical equipment. There are Standards which relate to the combustibility of furnishings etc. within a home but, again, I don't think they are necessarily relevant to electrical equipment.

Kind Regards, John