Remeha boilers and Honeywell CM9XX thermostats

[MJN]

the manufacturers do little to promote the technology, so it is the manufacturers who must carry the can on this one...

As you said earlier though Alec, they act in response to the market. Chicken and egg situation I suppose.

Also, there are manufacturers and there are manufacturers. It is those that produce the boilers that carry the keys to the gates as if they see there's more money to be made by supporting only closed-source proprietary control methods, and thus forcing the sale of their own products, then they are unlikely to allow the likes of Honeywell to steal their revenue and the bean counters at Honeywell are not going to support the release of a product whos market base is limited to only a handful of boiler models.

Mathew

 

[ALEC1]

all boilers in the UK for the past 3-5 years have had to accept OT controls, the market is perfectly big, and their are lots of installers who are interested...

OK the manufacturers would have to adopt a more imaginative marketing campaign to engage with them but its not impossible..

If only the manufactures concentrated on the market more than there BMWs..

 

[mysteryman]

...and pricey, not to mention severely limited in choice.

The sooner OT, or similar, becomes the de facto standard and ubiquitous the sooner we can cut the monopolising and allow natural market competition to produce the most effective, in terms of capability, usability and cost - products for installers and consumers to choose from.

Perhaps it is unfair to pin the blame solely on the manufacturers; there is afterall a whole generation of fitters who's understanding of technology options stretches little beyond bimetallic stats and who think that weather compensation is something the government pay out if we don't get a barbecue summer.

Mathew

The on-cost for a Vitodens 200-W with weather comp is £41 list, and you don't need to supply, fit or wire a room thermostat or programmer.

You are asking for choices which the end user doesn't need. You cannot control a condensing boiler better than by OEM weather compensation. Granted, the end user may not appreciate this, but it is so.

 

[ALEC1]

or TRVS MM for that matter...or buy a three port valve...as it is in the boiler

 

[MJN]

all boilers in the UK for the past 3-5 years have had to accept OT controls, the market is perfectly big, and their are lots of installers who are interested...

Fair enough. It is clear that I am not close enough to the business to know that that was the case. To clarify, any model I choose now will fully support OT?

If only the manufactures concentrated on the market more than there BMWs..

Given that it is the market that ultimately provides those BMWs I find it hard to believe that they are ignoring the demand that you say exists. Again though, this isn't my business so perhaps through the benefit of doubt I am giving them too much credit.

Mathew

 

[ALEC1]

OT or a variation..ebus for vaillant, km bus for viesmann and something else for Worcester bosch...

others like Atag and Broag use OT and their proprietary controls so are as good as the above.

When explaining frustration to a well known manufacturer about not getting information about compensation controls they asked "what exactly do you not know?"

The issue is that the trade/industry is in a "silly circle" heating engineers are the experts but no one advises us....


then there is the green deal......

 

[D_Hailsham]

on the behest of boiler manufacturers, OT on boilers has been dropped as a requirement by the EU

I don't know how up to date your info is, but in April 2011 the EU said:

Open protocol: If data is exchanged between temperature controller and boiler using an Open Communication Protocol, facilitating transformation to temperature controls classes III, IV, VI, VII, VIII and IX.

Open Communication Protocol means a standard specifying communication between boilers and temperature controls, and in particular facilitating use of temperature controls classes III, IV, VI, VII, VIII and IX, such that parts from multiple suppliers/manufacturers can be
connected to work together, and which fulfils all of the following conditions:

1. the standard is adopted and will be maintained by a not-for-profit organisation, and its ongoing development occurs on the basis of an open decision-making procedure available to all interested parties (such as consensus or majority decision);

2. the standard has been published and the standard specification document is available at a nominal charge. It must be permissible to all to copy, distribute and use it at a nominal charge (cost effective charge that covers the costs incurring when making the protocol available for all parties);

3. the intellectual property of (parts of) the standard is made irrevocably available to concerned parties on a royalty-free basis.

The control classes range from I (on/off stat) to IX (Multi-sensor room temperature control, for use with modulating boilers) and includes weather comp etc.

Although OT is not mentioned by name, it meets the definition.

This is all connected with EU directives on "ecodesign requirements for central heating equipment" and "energy labelling of central heating equipment."

Presumably the requirements will be tightened up over time so, like CH pumps, eventually you will only be able to install a system which meets Grade A.

 

[ALEC1]

I believe previously the directive did say OT...

The technology is not new to was developed at Glasgow University in the early 1980s, , the big questions is why are the manufacturers and regulatory bodies in the Uk so reticent about us installing it...