Replacement Battery

[Avocet]

Just an update, if it's of any use to anyone. I measure the current drain again, but WITHOUT the smart charger connected. As before, I did this without opening any doors and was careful to do it without breaking the connection. In other words, I clipped one meter probe to the cable and put the point of the other probe on the centre of the battery post, then carefully lifted the terminal off the post, until the meter showed a reading. This was to avoid measuring any "surge" current that might be flowing, immediately after a disconnection (if indeed, that might be a "thing")!

With the Ring smart charger connected to the battery (but not the mains), the current was 48 mA (as previously mentioned).
Without the smart charger connected, it was 31 mA, so it does look like the smart charger permanently consumes a very small amount of electrickery.

 

[Johntheo5]

I would think any diode will pass a small amount of current, so seems likely be it the car alternator or a smart charger there will be some discharge, but likely less that the self discharge, so not really enough to worry about.

Pre the smart charger the float charger would sit at a voltage selected to maintain the battery in normal use, for a 12 volt lead acid around 13.2 to 14.2 volt, so for example a stair lift often a bit on the high side at 14.2 volt as each time used it will go under voltage so the average charge rate is about right.

But the smart charger changed that, it will charge to say 14.4 then switch off, and remain off until battery hits 12.8 volt, then switch back on. Often a chart is published showing what the smart charger is designed to do, we have has stage chargers for years, but these typically turned off and stayed off, the smart charger will turn back on again.

However there is a variation make to make, the Lidi one I used if power is removed will not auto restart, one needs to press a button, it has to have this as the user selects battery size and ambient temperature, and because it will also work with 6 volt batteries the battery needs to be over 7.3 volt or it sees it as a 6 volt battery, and although it will restart charging, max rate is then 0.8 amp not 3.8 amp which is good in some ways, should one get a shorted cell, but if using the battery while on charge as with a caravan, then not such a good thing.

But since the charger has a volt meter built in, it shows at a glance state of battery.

The point is sulphur on the plates over time goes hard, and to remove it takes time, so a battery where interior lamp left on and discharged over 24 hours to recharge will likely only take 8 hours, but one discharged over 6 months, will likely take 2 weeks to recharge.

So it does no harm leaving it on charge for a week with a smart charger, so why not give it the extra time?

I have a LIdl smart charger, a Ultimate Speed ULGD3.8A which I have never used on my own cars (VWs) but occasionally recharge a old house alarm 7.5AH battery that I use occasionally for various small requirements around the house, after the initial charge it settles down and maintains a trickle charge seemingly indefinitely so I unlug it after 6 hours or so. I have used it occasionally on a few neighbours batteries, one, a 110AH in a 2L diesel Opel which was completely flattened by a cabin light being left on for over a week. As above, these chargers will not charge if the terminal volts are ~ < 7.5V so I had to connect a bit of cable between my car and his and after that the charger started charging, I removed the cable after 45 minutes or so and the charger fully restored his battery after ~ 24 hours and is still fine nearly 5 years later.
Below is the chart that was on the side of the box.
1 Reverse Polarity Protectionand Trickle charging and diagnosis.
2 Recharge/desulphation.
3 Start of charging with a high current strength.
4 Charging up to 80%.
5 Absorption charging up to 100%.
6 Trickle charging and monitoring.
7 Demand recharging.

 

[ericmark]

I have bought 3 Lidi chargers, first one failed and had no volt meter so there are diffrent versions of the 3.8 amp charger, I know one minimum charge rate over 12 Ah was 0.1 amp, under 12 Ah it was zero.

But using a power meter on input when the LED showed fully charged, it continued to charge.

 

[Johntheo5]

Mine gas the voltmeter and when floating at ~ 13.7V, indicates a power meter indicates 2.7W and 1.5W when charger not charging but powered up so floating charge rate ~ 1.2/13.7, 0.09A more or less what it claims.

 

[securespark]

OK. I have a plan (yes, yes, I know it takes me ages to decide....I am the world's worst procrastinator!)

I will give the battery a go on my CTEK charger.

If that fails to improve its lot, I am probably going to go for this:

EA770 Exide Premium Car Battery 067TE

Exide premium car batteries are Exide's leading wet lead acid battery range. They are boosted by carbon additives that are added to the plates which result in the batteries recharging up to 1.5 times faster. They are up to 30% more powerful than equivalent batteries and are ideal for powerful...

www.tayna.co.uk

However (procrastinate alert ahead!), I have found this place which is not too far away from us. They sell these, which are not a bad price and spec for the money. But the brand is ????. I think they must be made by another company and rebranded.

The spec is the same as Bosch/ Varta and the case is a very similar design, but the top is different. I have Googled it, but cant find any clues as to who makes them.

096 XD Car Battery | Car Batteries | 12 volt Heavy Duty | ABS Batteries

Type 096 XD+ 12 Volt Car Battery : The XD+ Series are geared for Extra Heavy Duty performance and increased reliability. The technology behind them makes full use of design elements such as Envelope Separation and Silver Calcium to greatly improve electrolyte performance. Incorporating Extra...

advancedbatterysupplies.co.uk

 

[mointainwalker]

The Trust pilot reviews look rather suspicious to me. A number of one-star reviews followed by several five-star one which are surprisingly similar: they are just a few lines emphasizing" great price, quick delivery "

" Ordered a new battery on Sunday evening 7pm It arrived Tuesday morning 10am !! Fitted myself In ten mins Great service Great price !!"
"Good price and quick delivery couldn’t ask for more."
"Good customer service and next day delivery. Sorted me out fast. Top class. Thanks."

They only have eight employees, so do you think they have the turnover to get an own-brand ?

 

[Stivino]

I read some reviews on someone I know. And I know for a fact that every review was left by friends and their wives.

 

[securespark]

I found them in this Auto Express 2020 review of best online battery retailers....

Best online battery retailers 2020 | Auto Express

We reveal the best online battery suppliers that'll save you in case of low charge

www.autoexpress.co.uk

 

[Johntheo5]

I usually buy Varta or Bosch (essentially the same), but in an attempt to spend less, someone said, why don't you look at the warranty period and buy the cheapest?

So I'm looking at Exide on Tayna's website.

As far as I can tell, for a 096 standard battery, they have 3:

Excell 71/ 670 3 year warranty for around £70.

Premium 72/ 720 4 year for 74.
Premium 77/ 770 4 year for 86.

By comparison,

A Varta 70/ 640 3 year is 91.
A Bosch 70/ 640 3 year is 99.

A Varta or Bosch 77/ 780 5 year is 101 or 102.

Does it really matter which I get?

Would I regret going for the cheapest Exide?

Don't know how battery warranty works in the UK but my neighbour has a BMW, he replaced his battery with a 4 year warranty Bosch, the battery packed up after 3 years, replaced FOC but the warranty on the new (same) replacement battery was only for the remainder of the original battery warranty, ~ 1 year.

 

[lostinthelight]

Don't know how battery warranty works in the UK but my neighbour has a BMW, he replaced his battery with a 4 year warranty Bosch, the battery packed up after 3 years, replaced FOC but the warranty on the new (same) replacement battery was only for the remainder of the original battery warranty, ~ 1 year.

Thats exactly what he got..a 4 year warranty on his original purchase and pretty much the same for any other purchase

 

[securespark]

Don't know how battery warranty works in the UK but my neighbour has a BMW, he replaced his battery with a 4 year warranty Bosch, the battery packed up after 3 years, replaced FOC but the warranty on the new (same) replacement battery was only for the remainder of the original battery warranty, ~ 1 year.

That's normal. All warranties in the UK only last for the original period, regardless. But in reality, his battery will last a lot longer.

My Bosch battery is 12 years old and has recently started to be a little reluctant to start in cold weather.

 

[norseman]

Don't know how battery warranty works in the UK but my neighbour has a BMW, he replaced his battery with a 4 year warranty Bosch, the battery packed up after 3 years, replaced FOC but the warranty on the new (same) replacement battery was only for the remainder of the original battery warranty, ~ 1 year.

Standard practice, at least in the UK.

 

[Johntheo5]

The consensus seems to be that the original battery gives the longest run, I have never been able to verify this, even though having owned cars (all new) for almost exactly 60 years, most remained in the family for 20+ years, I replaced the batteries in all of them after 12/13 years, only as a precaucion, the replacement batteries did last for the remainder of the cars lifetime. I only had one, my first, a 1963 6volt VW Beetle, where the battery actually failed after 6 years.

If I live long enough I'd be very interested to see how my present four year old car,+battery lasts with its smart alternator charging, it "only" charges to 12.8/13.0V while driving but once you lift off the accelerator, it charges at up to 14.8/15V, all the others charged, without exception, at 14.2/14.4V.

 

[norseman]

I think you are right about the originals lasting the longest. The last car my late parents bought new was a Toyota & the battery was replaced at 12 years, largely because the car used to stand for long periods. More frequent use could well have seen the battery last even longer.

Congrats. on your 60 years of car ownership. This month marks my 60th year of driving & probably 59 of them saddled with the financial burden of personal transport