TRV vs Room stat

[Goldberg]

It is under the building regs

Are you able to say where in The Building Regulations it states that a room thermostat is mandatory?

 

[bengasman]

I'm having a look but can't see the info anywhere, doing a search for "TRV's" within the page gives me nothing.

Can you help me out as to the where the info on the FAQ's is located please?

Central heating faq item 12

 

[bengasman]

It is under the building regs

Are you able to say where in The Building Regulations it states that a room thermostat is mandatory?

Of course he is able to do that, every pro is.

 

[Corgigrouch]

Just to satisfy our resident pedant, I believe that the regs state that the boiler must be fitted with an interlock, the use of a room stat satisfies this requirement.... Of course if the customer cannot afford such an extravegance, the reqirments may be bypassed if the installer gets the customer to sign a letter stating that the customer cannot afford such useless nonsense and the likes of TRVs and interlocks can be ignored.. I beleve that this is how the likes of Warmfront get away with it..... Of course I may be telling porky pies.....

If our pedant wishes chapter and verse, then I would be delighted to point him at the line "Find it yourself"

 

[Goldberg]

I believe that the regs state that the boiler must be fitted with an interlock

You believe wrongly.

None of the words "boiler", "thermostat", or "interlock" are contained within The Building Regulations.

You're probably thinking of this:

L1 Reasonable provision shall be made for the conservation of fuel and power in buildings by─
<snip>
(b) providing and commissioning energy efficient
fixed building services with effective controls; and
(c) providing to the owner sufficient
information about the building, the
fixed building services and their
maintenance requirements so that the
building can be operated in such a
manner as to use no more fuel and
power than is reasonable in the
circumstances.

No mention of any particular style of control being mandatory, just that "reasonable provision" is made.

the reqirments may be bypassed

No legal requirement may be bypassed.

Imaginary legal requirements can easily be bypassed though.

Of course I may be telling porky pies.

Why? Is that something that you do?

 

[davebgas]

I suggest you refer to
"Domestic heating compliance guide"

Section 2.2 part f

"the minimum provisions of boiler interlock, zoning and time control and temperature control of the heating and hot water circuits as described in table 2 should be met.

I suggest you read table 2.....

Oh and I'm sure you'll be googling this, i'll save you the trouble as you have no clue what you're talking about.... The DHCG is a second tier document of ADL1a and ADL1b as a source of guidance in complying with the Building regulations[/quote]

 

[Goldberg]

I suggest you refer to
"Domestic heating compliance guide"

Section 2.2 part f

The question was about The Building Regulations, so why would I want, or need, to refer to that?

You're falling headlong into the trap that has claimed countless people before you, which is that of believing that every document that the government issues somehow introduces a requirement to do something. But it doesn't.

"the minimum provisions of boiler interlock, zoning and time control and temperature control of the heating and hot water circuits as described in table 2 should be met.

I suggest you read table 2.

I can't think of one single reason for reading a document that isn't The Building Regulations, i.e. that isn't the law.

Oh and I'm sure you'll be googling this, i'll save you the trouble as you have no clue what you're talking about.... The DHCG is a second tier document of ADL1a and ADL1b as a source of guidance in complying with the Building regulations

I have a copy in front of me - have had for years. On a technical level there's nothing greatly wrong with it. In the context of the law, and the question I asked about The Building Regulations, the DHCG is 100% irrelevant.

 

[Goldberg]

So, to recap:

It is under the building regs

It isn't "under the building regs" at all.

 

[Corgigrouch]

Goldie,please show me where I have used the word "Legal" other than in this post...

Isn't it time that you went to collect your dole?

 

[Goldberg]

Isn't it time that you went to collect your dole?

I don't need dole money on top of what your wife pays me.

 

[davebgas]

Oh dear oh dear.

Re-read your building regs matey..
especially the line

"the provisions of controls that meet the minimum control requirements as given in the Domestic Heating compliance guide for the particular type of appliance and heat distribution system"

If its an irrelevant document why is the building regs referring to it

You really are a berk.

If you'd bother to qualify in anything, you'd also have come across the same sort of set up with the GS(I&U)R. In which is the main document but has an AcOP attached to it or as a second tier document. The 2nd tier document does not mean it is irrelevent but is a means of complying with the regulations, often detailing in a more 'user friendly' way.

You ignore the AcOP, and chances are you **** up on the regulatory adherence.
Have you read the GS(I&U)R's in its 'pure legal' format??? why do you think they print the guidance notes with it????

Oh, and if you find it nonsense, why have a copy?

 

[Goldberg]

"the provisions of controls that meet the minimum control requirements as given in the Domestic Heating compliance guide for the particular type of appliance and heat distribution system"

I don't where you're quoting from, but it isn't The Building Regulations.

If its an irrelevant document why is the building regs referring to it

Please see above.

The 2nd tier document does not mean it is irrelevent but is a means of complying with the regulations, often detailing in a more 'user friendly' way.

Ignoring the fact that you've invented the term "2nd tier", presumably with the aim of appearing to know something special, all of the government's guidance documents clearly state their purpose, which is simply that - guidance. They're not irrelevant per se, nor did I suggest that - I simply said that they're irrelevant in the context of a question about what's mandatory and what's in The Building Regulations.

You ignore the AcOP, and chances are you f***** up on the regulatory adherence.

I don't ignore the guidance documents, but they merely illustrate some ways of complying with the law.

Have you read the GS(I&U)R's in its 'pure legal' format?

Yes. I have a copy in front of me, and have had for years.

why do you think they print the guidance notes with it?

Because there are some people who can't understand the legalese.

Oh, and if you find it nonsense, why have a copy?

I suggest that you ask that of someone who thinks that it's nonsense.

 

[davebgas]

I've never heard a more convoluted piece of claptrap in all my life!!!

First you say

Ignoring the fact that you've invented the term "2nd tier",

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_PTL_DOMHEAT.pdf
5th paragraph down.... whats that say???? SECOND TIER DOCUMENT

YOU ABSOLUTE CRETIN. So don't come on here proclaiming to have one when you obviously cant even read the 1st bloody page!!!!


Second.....

the provisions of controls that meet the minimum control requirements as given in the Domestic Heating compliance guide for the particular type of appliance and heat distribution system"

I don't where you're quoting from, but it isn't The Building Regulations.

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_ADL1B_2006.pdf

Controlled services part 35

You absolute tool.....

Oh and two final quotes for you..

"These new approved documents are more strategic in nature and rely on 'second tier' documents to provide detailed information on the minimum provisions necessary to comply with the requirements of the regulations" Section 1

"Both approved documents refer to this pulication as the source of detailed guidance on what is reasonable provision" - Section 1.3

Thats from DHCG, you know, the one you have in front of you

Its saying in plain english just for you, that YOU NEED to listen to it to find the MINIMUM requirements as the building regs themselves do not contain it but instead tell you to refer to the DHCG.

Now go back under your rock..

 

[Goldberg]

First you say

Ignoring the fact that you've invented the term "2nd tier",

Yes that was a mistake - in my head I wrote "introduced", but my fingers typed "invented". I apologise.

YOU ABSOLUTE CRETIN.

Interesting. One mistake makes me a cretin?

And how many mistakes have you made on this topic?

So don't come on here proclaiming to have one when you obviously cant even read the 1st bloody page!

As I've said, it was a typing error. I know it's hard to believe that I make them, and that I'm not perfect, but I really am merely human.

the provisions of controls that meet the minimum control requirements as given in the Domestic Heating compliance guide for the particular type of appliance and heat distribution system"

I don't where you're quoting from, but it isn't The Building Regulations.

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/uploads/br/BR_PDF_ADL1B_2006.pdf

Controlled services part 35

You're not quoting from The Building Regulations, or from any document that makes anything mandatory, which is what all this was about.

Oh and two final quotes for you..

"These new approved documents are more strategic in nature and rely on 'second tier' documents to provide detailed information on the minimum provisions necessary to comply with the requirements of the regulations" Section 1

"Both approved documents refer to this pulication as the source of detailed guidance on what is reasonable provision" - Section 1.3

Thats from DHCG, you know, the one you have in front of you

Again - not in The Building Regulations. I've never said that they don't contain things that aren't reasonable provision, but there are other ways of making reasonable provision that are perfectly legal.

Its saying in plain english just for you, that YOU NEED to listen to it to find the MINIMUM requirements as the building regs themselves do not contain it but instead tell you to refer to the DHCG.

No, the The Building Regulations do not refer you, or me, or anyone, to the DHCG.

It doesn't matter how angry you get, or how personally abusive, or how much you want The Building Regulations to say what you claim they say, the fact remains that The Building Regulations don't mandate the use of a room thermostat.

 

[Goldberg]

So, to recap:

It is under the building regs

It isn't "under the building regs" at all.