UK could have controlled borders but chose not to and then blamed the EU.

[Doggit]

Yup, bigger border force needed, and one with a pair of cojones and an interest in doing their job properly; not the ineffectual bunch that just go through the motions.

Unless we have a French system of having to register where you reside, then it would be spot checks and the poilce picking up criminals which would inform the border control of an overstay.

 

[EFLImpudence]

Still don't see what you're actually getting at. How does our Border Force know if Piotr from Poland is coming for a holiday or deciding to stay.

Ask him? What do they do if you try to enter the US?

Stamp passport with entry date and record entry.
Obviously he can go underground if he does not want to be legal but if he wants to get a job, do everything legally and get residence and receive all the benefits of living in Britain then he will have to do it properly.

If he does decide to stay, how on earth do they trace him to deport him?

They may have difficulty until he comes to the notice of the authorities but he won't be costing Britain anything.

Or are you advocating having a bigger Border Force,

Presumably.

so there's enough people to do this tracing and deporting? (and if so, how do you propose financing it? Oh yes, that'll be up to us taxpayers again)

No pleasing some people.

So, what DO you want? Trump's wall? Britons banned from going abroad?

 

[EFLImpudence]

Judy, the next time you have a holiday in Benidorm, don't come back.

I'm not being rude - stay there and see how you get on.


Also, do you still live in the same place as where you were born?

If not, perhaps the natives of wherever you now live would prefer it if you had not moved there.

 

[Judy in the sky]

EFL, with the greatest of respect, anyone with a valid EU passport can legally enter the UK, with only a cursory check of their passport by the authorities. So in this respect the UK cannot "control" it's borders. How big a queue do you want to see at airports and sea ports if you expect our borders to be "controlled" ? When I go abroad to Europe, I have my EU passport given a cursory glance by some bored official at the airport. (sorry not been to the US yet) So, just on the point of a valid EU passport allowing legal entry to the UK,, how do we control our borders from EU immigration exactly? How long before some EU citizen claims it's an abuse of their human rights to be asked why they are coming here?

 

[EFLImpudence]

EFL, with the greatest of respect, anyone with a valid EU passport can legally enter the UK,

Yes, for three months unless they get job or can support themselves.

with only a cursory check of their passport by the authorities.

Whose fault is that?

So in this respect the UK cannot "control" it's borders.

It could. It's not the EU's fault that it does not.

How big a queue do you want to see at airports and sea ports if you expect our borders to be "controlled" ?

Big enough to do what you want.

When I go abroad to Europe, I have my EU passport given a cursory glance by some bored official at the airport. (sorry not been to the US yet)

They aren't as xenophobic as you.

So, just on the point of a valid EU passport allowing legal entry to the UK,, how do we control our borders from EU immigration exactly?

I have told you.

How long before some EU citizen claims it's an abuse of their human rights to be asked why they are coming here?

Would you mind if you were asked that?

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

Unless we have a French system of having to register where you reside,

The carte de sejour has not been in use for many years for EU citizens.

A permanent residency card for EU nationals is known as a "Carte de Sejour - Citoyen UE - Séjour permanent", and as the name implies, it gives the holder permanent residency (or a "séjour permanent").
It's not a compulsory card for European Union citizens so many won't even bother getting it, but it could be more relevant than ever for Brits after the Brexit vote has potentially made life more complicated.

https://www.thelocal.fr/20161116/how-do-i-get-permanent-residency-in-france

Residency in France for EU and non-EU Citizens: Know who needs a Carte de Séjour French Residence Permit and how and where to go about making an application...
The right of a person to live and work in France depends on their citizenship as follows:Non-European Union Citizens: A Carte de Séjour, also known as a Titre de Séjour, is a residence permit required by French law for any non-European Union citizen staying in France for a period longer than three months.They must apply for a long stay visa (visa long séjour) prior to leaving their home country.
European Union (EU) and European Economic Area (EEA) Citizens: All EU citizens and EEA citizens and their family members have the right to live and work in France and do not require a work or residence permit

https://www.angloinfo.com/how-to/france/moving/residency

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

EFL, with the greatest of respect, anyone with a valid EU passport can legally enter the UK, with only a cursory check of their passport by the authorities. So in this respect the UK cannot "control" it's borders. How big a queue do you want to see at airports and sea ports if you expect our borders to be "controlled" ? When I go abroad to Europe, I have my EU passport given a cursory glance by some bored official at the airport. (sorry not been to the US yet) So, just on the point of a valid EU passport allowing legal entry to the UK,, how do we control our borders from EU immigration exactly? How long before some EU citizen claims it's an abuse of their human rights to be asked why they are coming here?

It is a decision taken by individual countries. Some countries will wave through citizens from some EU countries, yet study and record the entry of citizens from other EU countries.
The EU does not enforce any rules on monitoring EU migrants, other than, as EFL mentioned, it provides parameters.
The simple fact that UK reduces or removes the allowable monitoring is a cost reduction process, nothing more.

 

[transam]

out of all the EU countries the UK & Ireland should be able to control there borders

after all we are an island , we have no land border with any other country so people cannot just walk here.

Well I suppose there is the channel tunnel ??? now forgot about that even so it should be easy (ish) to sort

 

[IWalkLikeHimaMartian]

out of all the EU countries the UK & Ireland should be able to control there borders

after all we are an island , we have no land border with any other country so people cannot just walk here.

Well I suppose there is the channel tunnel ??? now forgot about that even so it should be easy (ish) to sort

You have also forgotten that NI has a land border with the RofI. Do you know where that is?
You have also forgotten about Sicily, Zealand, Sardinia, Cyprus, Majorca, etc, etc, over a 100 of them, I think. Maybe..Hmmm
They all operate ferry services to the mainland, usually with little more than an ID caed.

 

[SirGalahad]

http://www.itv.com/news/2016-02-03/what-benefits-can-eu-migrants-claim/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-25134521

If we had accurate entry and exit records then these could be used to manage migration issues better.

After 3 months the person has to register that they are either in employment or seeking employment. If they are seeking employment at this stage the government can decide to either let them remain or ask them to leave - well within its rights to do that.

If they plan to stay then you can restrict benefits - again is well within the countries rights.

 

[SirGalahad]

Typical socialist response. When the Tories lowered the corporation tax rate, they got £5bn more corp tax in, but that could have been from an increase in GDP, but where did that come from? And in reducing the corporation tax, they increased other taxes to help offset any reductions that might have occured. Unfortunately, it's not en exact science, and often a stab in the dark which they can crow about if it works.

There is a multitude of factors - the bank levy raised about £1.5bn plus, there is a change of dates when corp tax appears (but receipts are still up), as mentioned the economy has grown, corp profitability has increased,

But where it falls down is the weak investment spending - the argument that if corp tax is reduced investments will be increased has not panned out - investment spending fell by 2% in 2016.

 

[SirGalahad]

And therein lies the biggest problem at the minute. The likes of Apple, and Amazon are sitting on obscene piles of money due to such practices, yet the governments don't get to gether to tighten the global rules. Tax revenues leeches out of a country, and don't get taxed at their correct rate, and that's where we're losing out. It is the biggest scandal going on at the minute, and we would have a much more secure economy if we could tackle this insidious practice.

The truth of the likes of McDonnell, is that they don't understand economics at all, only how to tax the easy targets, and give out nice easy slogans that the left wing can repeat ad nauseam to make themselves think they understand economics.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...-to-water-down-transparency-rules-over-trust/

We don't have all the politicians fighting for this.

 

[SirGalahad]

By the way Doggit why do you call me a socialist? Also can you explain what you mean by being socialist?

 

[Doggit]

Read a dictionary, and see if you can recognise the impression you give us.

 

[SirGalahad]

Read a dictionary, and see if you can recognise the impression you give us.

I don't know how you think thats why I asked you the question. If I recall correctly you are in favour of nationalising railways or utilities - is that socialism? Is having a defence budget and army socialism as its for the common good?

I don't know what to make of the term socialism from your perspective as you clearly use terms like "living beyond our means" which are subjective.