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UK Finance......
- Thread starter noseall
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How so. You want to discuss the points, has the Uk made a miraculous change?
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sure, its more irrelevant (well less relevant) than out of date, but:
- It starts from a point where the UK was still the global British Empire. Like all Empires the only way is down. Analysis of our ranking in the late 1800 or even 50 years later has little relevance today
- It snapshots the UK in 2010 (2012 is the context) after the UK had not yet properly recovered from the economic downturn of 2008.
- It assumes that declining manufacturing is some how a failure. The 2012 coalition prioritised re-balancing the economy, but why? UK occupies the high value, high margin industries: design, services etc.
I'm not convinced decline in economic status (which measured more recently doesn't correlate with the essay) is linked to decline in manufacturing or vice-a-versa.
I think this report (written about the same time) has a better view:
https://www.pwc.co.uk/assets/pdf/ukmanufacturing-300309.pdf
and this https://www.pwc.co.uk/assets/pdf/uk-manufacturing-report-sectors.pdf
- It starts from a point where the UK was still the global British Empire. Like all Empires the only way is down. Analysis of our ranking in the late 1800 or even 50 years later has little relevance today
- It snapshots the UK in 2010 (2012 is the context) after the UK had not yet properly recovered from the economic downturn of 2008.
- It assumes that declining manufacturing is some how a failure. The 2012 coalition prioritised re-balancing the economy, but why? UK occupies the high value, high margin industries: design, services etc.
I'm not convinced decline in economic status (which measured more recently doesn't correlate with the essay) is linked to decline in manufacturing or vice-a-versa.
I think this report (written about the same time) has a better view:
https://www.pwc.co.uk/assets/pdf/ukmanufacturing-300309.pdf
and this https://www.pwc.co.uk/assets/pdf/uk-manufacturing-report-sectors.pdf
Current colleague used to work at "The Rover", on the "track of tears" (their name for the production line).
Shop floor had no time or respect for anyone in shirt and tie (even visiting customers), let alone management.
They were very well paid, relative to what they did / didn't produce.
They had no pride in their work, and no consequence from poor-quality work.
Quality control was poor, and the product was inferior to foreign competitors' offerings.
Union was all-too-ready to call the workforce out (poor relationship with "management").
While it is all too easy to blame the management, the unions didn't want to work with the management at all; they wanted to wag the dog.
Shop floor had no time or respect for anyone in shirt and tie (even visiting customers), let alone management.
They were very well paid, relative to what they did / didn't produce.
They had no pride in their work, and no consequence from poor-quality work.
Quality control was poor, and the product was inferior to foreign competitors' offerings.
Union was all-too-ready to call the workforce out (poor relationship with "management").
While it is all too easy to blame the management, the unions didn't want to work with the management at all; they wanted to wag the dog.
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Its all about attitude and management. Look at Tesla, 2007 they do deal with Lotus to license the Elise body, 2017 they have the same Market Cap as BMW.
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https://www.sheffield.ac.uk/news/nr/manufacturing-decline-report-speri-1.656114
What you need to look at is how do we grow as an economy? One way is through increases in productivity and technological change which are more prevalent in the manufacturing industry. The service sector will always be limited by its very nature - service industries are not great at productivity gains - (look into baumol cost disease - it still takes on doctor to provide a consultation today but one car worker is more productive than one 20 years ago).
The idea we can simply retreat to higher margin sectors assumes these sector are somehow insulated from foreign competition. Currently through neo liberal policies our growth has been achieved on the back of rising private debt and we have a "renty" economy.
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I disagree, not about the renty economy - interest rates have been too low for too long imo. I disagree about services. Its not the factory worker that is more productive, its the factory that is more productive. Things like software development (services), process automation (services) more efficient design (services) is where the enabler is. In 10 years or less a chatbot will be able to not only deliver IT support, but do basic professional services, like writing a will, conveyancing your home, managing your investment portfolio.
Not exclusively; considering your example below:
A doctor might still only be able to see, say, 4 patients per hour, but a doctor's indirect productivity can also be measured by whether they facilitate the [car worker's, in your post] quicker return to work, better performance of their role, etc.
i.e. a doctor can enable their patient to be more productive, and can share in that patient's productivity gains.
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Your not talking about productivity there but externalities and a very spurious one and its not how productivity is measured. I can then say penicillin increases productivity using your logic.
I understand the point you are making though.
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I don't think you understand how productivity is measured. Sure a factory is more productive but labour is a factor of production and now a worker on say an assembly plant is more productive than one 20 years ago for numerous reasons.
Are you talking about the out of software development or the process of developing software?
As to automation - its already here and people don't realise. Look at what Ray Daliois doing.
https://www.theguardian.com/technol...ociates-ai-artificial-intelligence-management
"The world’s largest hedge fund is building a piece of software to automate the day-to-day management of the firm, including hiring, firing and other strategic decision-making."
But like all AI it has its biases and weaknesses so watching the outcome of that move will be interesting.
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I suspect that even if Brexit was reversed (by Parliament throwing out 'the deal' - when we know what 'the deal' is, or no deal), a second referendum, a change of PM, or another election, the damage to UK economy is already substantial and probably irreversible for many years.
Depending on the disarray or the timing of the 'change of heart', the economic damage might be permanently irreversible.
If sufficient financial institutes move out of London, and a new successful financial 'city' is established in Europe, there would be no sense in those institutes moving back to London if Brexit was reversed.
Depending on the disarray or the timing of the 'change of heart', the economic damage might be permanently irreversible.
If sufficient financial institutes move out of London, and a new successful financial 'city' is established in Europe, there would be no sense in those institutes moving back to London if Brexit was reversed.
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