Water Pipe Leaking In 2 Different Places Under Kitchen Floor?

[Burnerman]

So this drain is more or less at skirting level for most of its run, is that correct?
That's not the best, but sometimes unavoidable......the coffee grounds are a serious no - no but they would only block the thing, not cause a leak.
John

 

[Gorguruga]

The trunking can be prised away from the top of the skirting and if you have a wood chisel or similar, attack the skirting from the corner joint.....it may be nailed on, or stuck with no nails adhesive or whatever.
The fact that the water is coming from where the skirting meets the tile floor has to indicate a fault with the pipe. How far away is the sink?
Has any other work been carried out in that area.....nailing, screwing etc?
A pic of the outside around the deck area could be useful, just so we can see the drain exiting the wall.
John

I might attempt to remove the skirting today if the plumber can't make it over. No other work was carried out in the area recently other than when the electrician came over and removed one socket (after he noticed the damp wall) and rewired the other socket with the trunking. We were noticing small pools of water before this though but I think the pipe breach/water pooling has worsened since he left - but this may well have happened with or without him there since the pipe had definitely already been leaking before he came over. He did drill into the wall just millimetres above the skirting board for the wiring/trunking (and about a foot away from the 1st pool in the photo).

 

[Gorguruga]

Picture of the drain, John. Unfortunately can't see the kitchen pipe which I think is just underneath that black roof gutter pipe.

 

[Gorguruga]

t!

So this drain is more or less at skirting level for most of its run, is that correct?
That's not the best, but sometimes unavoidable......the coffee grounds are a serious no - no but they would only block the thing, not cause a leak.
John

Yes, drain is at the skirting level give or take a few cm. I can't quite make out the actual kitchen drainpipe but I think it's just a few cm beneath the black gutter pipe. When I have the tap on full blast I could sometimes see a trickle of water coming from just underneath the roof pipe.

 

[Burnerman]

Very difficult to see, but that downcomer doesn't seem to be doing the deck much good!
Whatever happens, time for some investigation......all we know is that there is a leak....maybe the water from the 'first' leak is running down the wall or pipe to appear as the second.
For the life of me, I cant see why this has started unless there has been a nail poked through it or as a long shot, the drain is copper and has eroded through - most unlikely.
John

 

[dilalio]

Did anyone try and use a sink plunger to clear a blockage in recent weeks? That can push apart push fit connectors... Happened to me lots of times- accompanied by lots of swearing about who fitted the damn waste in the first place with myriad push fit couplings from Wickes cos they could only get small sections of pipe in at a time

 

[Gorguruga]

Here's what I'd do...

Run taps into kitchen sink but trap it there with plug. Leave for 30 mins to confirm its not from hot & cold feeds or connections to taps.

Add food dye to water in bowl of sink, then realease to waste.

See if water pools as described above and if it is coloured with food dye.

I just filled up the sink, left for half an hour. No leaking.

Released all the water in one go and it created the biggest pool of water yet at the 1st pool, it seemed to be leaking slowly over the course of about 3-4 minutes.

The 2nd pool near the fusebox had far less water. However, I've opened the cupboard and had a closer look at skirting board level (no skirting in the cupboard just thin plasterboard) and I've noticed that base of this board is damp. Pretty worrying because the fusebox and various electrical connections and the meter is just about a foot above this damp area.

I think I'll have to bite the bullet and make sure a plumber comes over today, shouldn't really delay any longer.

 

[Gorguruga]

Very difficult to see, but that downcomer doesn't seem to be doing the deck much good!
Whatever happens, time for some investigation......all we know is that there is a leak....maybe the water from the 'first' leak is running down the wall or pipe to appear as the second.
For the life of me, I cant see why this has started unless there has been a nail poked through it or as a long shot, the drain is copper and has eroded through - most unlikely.
John

The pipes inside the cupboard (including the water mains) appear to be copper so it might have eroded somewhere?

I've just called a plumber who has given me a reasonable quote for the work (£120 to £150). I think I'm going to go ahead and try taking off the skirting board now from the joint. First I'll try to detach the electrical trunking and then remove the board as you mentioned earlier. I do have a hammer but only a slotted screwdriver instead of specific tools, would that be ok for the job?

 

[Gorguruga]

Plumber is going to be here soon but I'm beginning to wonder if the pipe might actually be external under the decking, although how then would it leak inside at various points?

I've almost removed the skirting, the plaster board behind is wet and I can't see a pipe back there, although it is covered with plasterboard still, I should probably try to cut a piece out.

 

[Gorguruga]

Hmm, I've cut a piece out of from behind the loose skirting board and can't see a pipe inside!

 

[dilalio]

You need to trace that waste route. It'll be there somewhere!
Getting at it has to be done before leak can be addressed! Is plumber going to make good afterwards?

 

[Gorguruga]

Job done Dilalio, it turned out that there was a hidden drain underneath the decking which was blocked and the water was seeping through a hole in the wall just underneath the window!

Plumber broke through some of the damp plasterboard, removed the skirting board completely and drilled into the wall to detect the leak. He didn't make good afterwards so I'll have to see to the repair but he advised that it needs to be left open to dry for a few days anyway because I can see the brickwork is quite damp at the base all along that wall.

I might make a separate post in the building forum about how to best go about the repair in a few days.

Thanks very much to everyone who responded, your tips and knowledge really were greatly, greatly appreciated. So relieved the problem is solved!

 

[Burnerman]

Blimey I think I've heard it all now.....the outside drain under the deck was blocked and overflowing back into the house
That sort of indicates a level issue with the drain, but no worries, delighted it's been sorted - as should be the gap allowing the water back.
It's a simple enough job to make the skirting good, but allow it to completely dry first......it could well stink a bit.
John

 

[dilalio]

Was it coffee grinding blocking the drain?

 

[Gorguruga]

Blimey I think I've heard it all now.....the outside drain under the deck was blocked and overflowing back into the house
That sort of indicates a level issue with the drain, but no worries, delighted it's been sorted - as should be the gap allowing the water back.
It's a simple enough job to make the skirting good, but allow it to completely dry first......it could well stink a bit.
John

Surely does stink a bit lol. Soon as I removed the skirting the smell started wafting in.

During the leak detection, the plumber himself kept saying "this is a weird one" so I took some snaps.

Here's the hole next to the pipe going through the wall. Plumber advised I get a bottle of expanding foam and spray it into the hole. He said that on the interior hole which is almost exactly opposite this on the other side of the wall, it's best to use some sort of concrete mix.

Here are the two drains next to each other: