Who makes lights which last?

[ericmark]

The integral, non-replaceable lamps do not fit my criteria for standard and simple replacement.

In the main, I agree. However the big problem is the bulb no longer emits light as intense or omnidirectional to the old tungsten bulb, so even if using bulbs, one often needs to change the lamp to suit the new bulbs, I ended up with this instead of a single 150 watt bulb which did light the room, one they shine up to a white ceiling which spreads the light, but we still have 48 watt instead of 150 watt, and the on line charts say 28 - 23 watt, so I am using double what the conversion charts say.

Outside I have carriage lamps, one odd one out with frosted glass is integral, and I have to admit it lights the area far better than the bulbs in lamps type. So I can see the point in the integral lamp, the LED's are arranged to give max output, however with a one off great, but with matching lights getting them to match when replacing is a problem, that 8 bulb chandelier had the bulbs changed as daughter complaining of a head ache, which seemed to cure the problem, and a couple have failed, the chandelier in old house proved too dim, so swapped the bulbs from 3 watt to 5 watt, bulbs not wasted, just moved elsewhere.

Many of my lamps now have smart bulbs, a smart switch typical £25 for type not needing neutral, smart bulb £9 so the bulb is the cheap method to get remote control, and the bulb can be colour charging, the same to dim lights, so easy with a smart bulb, no working out leading or lagging, or if the unit can be dimmed to start with, it just makes life easy changing a bulb.

This

may work very well, standard sizes, so easy to replace, but to me looks too much like an office not a home.

 

[JohnW2]

Integral are my go to at the moment, ...

As a matter of interest, I wonder why?

If a product inevitable contains 'consumable'components (or, at least, components of limited lifespan, which may even 'fail early') it seems a little odd (and not too good for the environment, nor, in theory, 'cost-effectiveness') to buy products in which those components cannot be replaced without replacing the whole item.

I doubt that (m)any people would buy printers which didn't have 'replaceable ink', Even battery-operated products whose batteries are not replaceable are usually/often pretty questionable, and there are countless other examples - so I wonder why it is different with lights.

We do live in an increasingly 'throwaway'/'disposable' world, so there are, of course, many products with non-replaceable 'consumables' around, and that may in some cases not be unreasonable. For example, if it is decided that, for other reasons, a smoke detector needs to be replaces every 10 years, then a battery likley to last for at least 10 years does not necessarily need to be replaceable (and making it non-user-replaceablemakes it much more difficult for users to remove it!

Kind Regards, John

 

[securespark]

Why does anyone favour one brand over another?

I'll give you a clue: reliability and length of warranty go a long way to helping people make a choice.

Think of taxis. I know a few taxi drivers who run a Toyota and they are renowned for their longevity.

How many LED luminaires are there with replaceable parts?

 

[JohnD]

I know a few taxi drivers who run a Toyota and they are renowned for their longevity.

We're on the third in this household, for that very reason.

The last one was going fine at 18 years old.

 

[JohnW2]

Why does anyone favour one brand over another? .... I'll give you a clue: reliability and length of warranty go a long way to helping people make a choice.

Reliability is obviously a crucial factor. However, very few individuals will have personal experience of large enough numbers of enough different brands over long enough period of time to be able to make a reasonable assessment of relative reliability of the different brands ... so one has to wonder what is the basis of them preferring a particular brand.

Sme may, indeed, also pay attention to length of warranty, maybe at least partially (in addition to 'the obvious') thinking it reflects the manufacturer's view of likely reliability. However, I'm not so sure that is necessarily true. Having discussed this with good few sales and marketing people over the years/decades. it seems that, in relation to 'relatively cheap' items (e.g. many luminaires, but not washing machines, computers of cars), they often work on the assumption (based on past experience) that relatively few people will bother to make warranty claims, so that they can offer attractive (perhaps over-optimistic) warranty lengths without being likely to have to pay out all that much in claims.

How many LED luminaires are there with replaceable parts?

If 'parts' included the 'light-producing' part, then, in my (humble or not!) opinion, far too few - but opinions about that will vary

 

[JohnD]

Reliability is obviously a crucial factor. However, very few individuals will have personal experience of large enough numbers of enough different brands over long enough period of time to be able to make a reasonable assessment of relative reliability of the different brands ... so one has to wonder what is the basis of them preferring a particular brand.

Some read reports of tests carried out by reputable consumer organisations.

 

[SUNRAY]

Expensive but it pays off.

My experience so far is expensive and never catches up. Replacing 3 pendands of of 2x 60W & 1x 11W CFL In our hall with 3 triple fittings with 9x 3W led struggles with light levels (and some flickered badly), and since (I think) 2017 have so far got through batches of: 10 unbranded, 12 unbranded, 12 Energisers, 10 Philips and 10 unbranded at a cost ITO £120. Since Christmas 2022 we have all Home Bargain own brand at £30 which to date appear to be outlasting everything else.

I started marking the date of fitting bulbs in early noughties, one of the 60W was unmarked so had been in service for>15 years, t'other was 2007 IIRC and the CFL was several years later. I think I only recall fitting one or perhaps 2 more since we moved here in 1994 so say £4 in 23 years Vs £150 in 7 years is a markup of around 12000%, as to energy used I doubt we average 1 hour/day @ say15p (averaged over the years) is £12/year and it's costing me more than that to replace bulbs. Even if we average 2 hours/day we haven't broken even.

EDIT: my figures are rough 'in the head' calculations, hopefully close enough for Jazz.

 

[foxhole]

I buy led bulbs from Screwfix, if they fail I purchase again and immediately return failed bulbs for refund

 

[JohnW2]

Some read reports of tests carried out by reputable consumer organisations.

They do, but then it is not really them who "favour" a particular brand but, rather, those who undertake the tests and publish their reports (which anyone can look at)

 

[JohnW2]

..... since (I think) 2017 have so far got through batches of: 10 unbranded, 12 unbranded, 12 Energisers, 10 Philips and 10 unbranded at a cost ITO £120. Since Christmas 2022 we have all Home Bargain own brand at £30 which to date appear to be outlasting everything else.

Similar to my experiences that I reported - with 'the cheapest I can find' generally out-lasting 'the most expensive ('very reputable brand') I can find'.

As I previously said, that could be partially because the more expensive ones are electronically more complex (hence 'more to go wrong;'), but the 'reason' doesn't alter the bottom-line conclusion.

 

[SUNRAY]

We're on the third in this household, for that very reason.

The last one was going fine at 18 years old.

It's not only Toyotas which live long and prosper.
I live in a road where lots of old cars are still going strong, first E regTriumph Herald (one owner), D reg fiesta, Hillman Imp (2 owners), Hillman Minx, VW camper van, Riley 1.5 was only scrapped a couple of years ago due to accident damage (hit by a Tesla which was also written off, it's driver banned for 5 years DD 3rd offence), S reg Ford galaxy, 03 reg Ford Kia, 02 reg Ford Escort was recently disposed of due to dementure - it looked and ran like new, the Bedford Midi I sold 26 years ago is still going and the Bedford CF which predated it is still in use on a farm with minimal attention running on red deisel (I towed a caraven there as a favour for the farmer and he made an offer for the van too).
Most of the above are owned by elderly people or their family who have owned the vehicles for many years

 

[morqthana]

I think that's the trouble.

It's also what I need to buy to meet my wants.

I don't want miniature - 250mm ± diameter is ideal, but I want as low profile as possible. I'd have totally flush if I could, but then I would be really hosed if I couldn't get replacements exactly the same size.

 

[morqthana]

This View attachment 341472 may work very well, standard sizes, so easy to replace, but to me looks too much like an office not a home.

It does. On the plus side, you know you're always going to be able to buy 600mm panels.

What we need is for a de-facto standard for round lights to become established.

 

[morqthana]

Some read reports of tests carried out by reputable consumer organisations.

They can't and don't test, and AFAIK don't survey, the longevity of integral lights.

 

[morqthana]

But I can say with absolute certainty that if lighting was made up to a quality standard and not down to a price there's no reason why products couldn't last for decades.