Am I being conned by British Gas?

[Agile]

That is a good policy but a little over the top.

However, as I understand it a flue flow test is required under the Gas Regulations and in this case at least does not seem to have been done.

The flue flow test, if passed, would usually make any problems unlikely at any power within the rated range.

Tony

 

[petit_pablo]

Flue flow would have been done. I don't think any BG engineer would skip that bit.

 

[Rampage77]

It probably failed the flue gas ratio on max because its a 23 year back boiler, and I doubt the BG engineer has done anything wrong.

 

[45yearsagasman]

The flue flow test, if passed, would usually make any problems unlikely at any power within the rated range

 

[RickyW64]

Hello

On the checklist sheet for the fire it reads

ASV FIRE
PASSED FF & SPILLAGE
FSD OK
17.3MB

Is this the flue flow test being referred to?

 

[petit_pablo]

Hello

On the checklist sheet for the fire it reads

ASV FIRE
PASSED FF & SPILLAGE
FSD OK
17.3MB

Is this the flue flow test being referred to?

Yep

 

[RickyW64]

Hi

So can I check if I've got this right, the boiler, it's at risk, but this seems to be due to a test that doesn't strictly have to be done, but BG do it.

It is not presenting any immediate risk when it is operated at its usual settings, which is why the engineer didn't lock it off? However, this is subject to different professional interpretations and some would lock it off due to any potential risk?

Just a couple of questions, if I'm covered under the BG Homecare and it used to work perfectly and pass year in/out, should I expect them to discover what is causing the failure at the higher rate and expect them to put it right?

If I moved from BG at the end of my current contract to an alternative company, if they tested the boiler and didn't find it to be at risk in their prof opinion, can the At Risk status be removed?

Rick

 

[Rampage77]

You could get them back to look into what's causing the high ratio, but personally I wouldnt. Ive work for a few large companies and they never asked us to do flue gas checks on back boilers. I have had +25 year old wall mounted boilers in the same scenario, high burner pressure high CO and then when reduced working fine. Checked everything possible and nothing was located that would be causing it. It's probably down to its age, when older boilers start to "kettle" this can push the CO limit above the required level. Like you said they have left it running safe and I'm sure he would have done all his tests, so I wouldn't worry about it. Maybe worth looking into getting a new boiler at some point. (although it could possibly chug along for a few more years yet)

 

[RickyW64]

Thanks to everyone who has helped on this thread, its much appreciated

 

[ScottishGasMan]

To be honest to me that seem seriously wrong.

While according to the unsafe situations procedure Flued appliances that fail an FGA test are only considered AR, I would be worried that its an open flued appliance which is failing (45yeargasmans point that on an open flue it used to be considered ID if it failed a performance test)

I would personally be looking at Unsafe Sits 10.2 - Appliances which are unsafe due to inadequate maintenance = ID

That boiler should be passing a performance test by a country mile (as in less than 0.0010 on max) after a good clean and any necessary maintenance carried out. I still service a dozen of these a year and they are not hard to get burning clean on max rate. Its not a safe or acceptable soloution to just downrate the boiler (used to be a long time ago, not anymore)



As for the powerflush, Do all the radiators heat well evenly througout the panels (ie no cold spots)? If so and drained water is clear then you dont need a powerflush. A bottle of inhibitor would be nice, but not a powerflush.

 

[RickyW64]

Hi ScottishGasMan

Are you saying that it is likely BG aren't cleaning the boiler thoroughly enough? (I think I need a Gas for Dummies book!)

Re the rads, they do all heat well and evenly and no gunge at all coming out of them.

Rick

 

[St0rmer66]

SGM - for an ID situation, is it leaking either gas or POC's? No... Then at At Risk if it COULD in future. So downrated it's passing the FGA, it's At Risk. I agree that with proper cleaning it "should" come down though! (not trying to preach, I respect your opinion).

I remember having an open flue Kingfisher which I cleaned with water and a tray underneath (pouring from the top), all seals were intact, burner and injectors fine and it just would not pass an FGA on max no matter what I did. Easy pass on medium rate though! Sometimes "it's just old" seems to be the answer as much as we wish it wasn't!

Doesn't sound like this system needs a powerflush at all. Did he show you a water sample to prove it? Supposed to be checked with a turbidity tube these days and the powerflush certificates have a before and after to show improvement. Some of our local upgrades guys have turned up to do a flush booked in by someone else and had to cancel the job because it didn't fail in the first place! (rare occasion but I've heard of it). Don't worry about your cover, you can challenge any decisions. Ask for a different engineer next time if you think this particular one is trying to upsell for the sake of it, not all are created equal unfortunately.

 

[Agile]

I remember having an open flue Kingfisher which I cleaned with water and a tray underneath (pouring from the top), all seals were intact, burner and injectors fine and it just would not pass an FGA on max no matter what I did. Easy pass on medium rate though! Sometimes "it's just old" seems to be the answer as much as we wish it wasn't!

I agree that these old appliances should walk through any FGA test on maximum power.

However, it seems to me that the problem ( if it's HE is totally clean ) could be a lack of air supply or the flue or terminal.

When doing that kind of testing do you try the effect of improving air supply by opening windows etc?

I don't see that "age" alone could have any influence.

Tony

 

[St0rmer66]

I remember having an open flue Kingfisher which I cleaned with water and a tray underneath (pouring from the top), all seals were intact, burner and injectors fine and it just would not pass an FGA on max no matter what I did. Easy pass on medium rate though! Sometimes "it's just old" seems to be the answer as much as we wish it wasn't!

I agree that these old appliances should walk through any FGA test on maximum power.

However, it seems to me that the problem ( if it's HE is totally clean ) could be a lack of air supply or the flue or terminal.

When doing that kind of testing do you try the effect of improving air supply by opening windows etc?

I don't see that "age" alone could have any influence.

Tony

Passed flue flow and spillage test (even on max). This particular boiler was on a landing in the airing cupboard if I remember correctly (it was years ago now). Short flue run through the loft, all visible and intact. Air vents all correctly sized. I wasn't the first person to attempt to sort it! Think it got replaced shortly after.

 

[RickyW64]

Re the water, he didn't show me a sample, but he was collecting water into a small container on the garden, which was of course overflowing. The only reason I can think for this was so he could show me dirty water, but it was in fact crystal clear so he just ignored this when I pointed it out when he was trying to convince me to have a power flush or the magnetic device.

Just had a thought that when the flue test was performed, there was a computer desk that was pushed up just in front of the air brick/vent (within a couple of inches). The desk has now been moved. Could this have affected the test? I wasn't there at the time, but wife doesn't think this was mentioned as a problem and thinks the living room door may have been open anyway.

Rick