Failed EICR

Attached is the new EICR (I cut out names ...).
Previous EICR only mentioned: C3 light at rear of building not working - missing neutral + C3 absence of RCD.
 

Attachments

  • EICR_1.pdf
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Can you tell me what you think about EICR without seeing the installation?
Can someone tell me how much I will have to invest for the remedial works?
Thanks.
Letty
 
Good grief!

It would be a lot easier for us to comment if the report said what the alleged non-compliances actually were!

Kind Regards, John
 
It is not a new installation but it is maintained and clean, I mean this is not an old wooden board with wires dangling (see photo).
I have a tenant since Sept, the agent who has full management since Sept as well never mentioned the state of the electrics as a mess.

Is all that remedial work doable with the tenant in?

Would it be better to ask for another EICR to be made by another electrician to compare and challenge this one? Is that legal or am I held by this EICR now. It says I have to do the works before the 22/03, time is limited.

I am bothered as I wanted to renew all the installation as well as the kitchen (in which the electricity meter and gas meter are installed) in the same time in 1 year or 2 when house is empty. I suppose that I have no choice!?
 

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  • Box_Elec.jpg
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Would it be better to ask for another EICR to be made by another electrician to compare and challenge this one? Is that legal or am I held by this EICR now. It says I have to do the works before the 22/03, time is limited.
This is one of the major problems with the new legislation that has been discussed (here and elsewhere), since it does not seem to offer any option to get a 'second opinion', even if the initial EICR appears to be crazy.

Kind Regards, John
 
From reading your EICR I would suggest that a replacement consumer unit would resolve virtually all of the observations listed.

Having seen your photograph it now renders the EICR null and void. It does not reflect your installation and can not be trusted to be accurate.
 
RF Lighting,
In the box, my husband says there are only Circuit Breakers.
The RCBO outside is for the lights of the bathroom that has been completely renewed this summer.
 
The separate enclosure contains two RCDs and appears to be labelled as sockets and lights although the picture is a little hazy when zoomed in.

There is no mention of any RCD protection at all in your EICR nor any test results for them so the report clearly does not accurately represent the true condition of your installation. If they got this obvious thing wrong, what else may be wrong in the report?
 
There is no mention of any RCD protection at all in your EICR nor any test results for them so the report clearly does not accurately represent the true condition of your installation. If they got this obvious thing wrong, what else may be wrong in the report?
Quite so - and not only does the report clearly indicate that there were no RCDs, but one assumes that (in the absence of specific details) many of the observations coded as C2 relate to an alleged absence of any RCD protection.

It's so seemingly bizarre (even if one allows for possible incompetence) that I can't help but wonder whether the report provided actually relates to the OP's installation!

Kind Regards, john
 
I presume that you mean "...which should be C1..."? Did you see this recent one posted here? ...

View attachment 224486

It may not have happened to you but, as we've seen, it seems to be becoming an increasing problem. I have to say that, if it were me, I would, at the very least, be annoyed to be paying out for something that I didn't believe needed doing, even if it was not a great expense.

We're hearing of cases of plastic CUs being given C2s. Would you be happy to pay for a CU replacement if that 'happened to you'?
One of the problems we've discussed here is that the legislation does not seem to offer that option. It would seem that if the landlord has not remedied all C1/C2s within 28 days of the date of the initial EICR, he/she would then be in breach of the law, and (as far as I can make out) the only apparent 'appeals' processes only seem to become available after the LA have reacted because the law has been broken.
That, of course, is 'the answer'. IF one has access to an inspector who one can totally trust to be competent and sensible (and not 'on the make'), then there is no problem. However, most landlords are not in your position and are 'in the laps of the gods' when selecting an inspector - with some of the results that we have seen here.

Kind Regards, John
I presume that you mean "...which should be C1" I'll change it to either or both of these:
I certainly hope I never have anything in any of my properties which could be accurately described as C1
I certainly hope I never have anything in any of my properties which is C1

3 years ago I did change a plastic CU to a metal version, well before rental property rules changed and October last year I did another two, one of which even had a metal front so once again preempted the EICR, So that really is a moot question in my situation. However at home I still have a plastic CU so in reality I'm keeping my rental properties more up to date than my own home in that respect.

Any coding by an inspector can be signed off/corrected by another competant person so no real appeal needed.

Yes I realise I am in a very fortunate position but even more fortunately for others, the people I know do not actually treat me any different, realistically any landlord will get the same accurate report from them.
 
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Any coding by an inspector can be signed off/corrected by another competant person so no real appeal needed.
In the context of the PRS legislation (at least, if one takes it literally), I'm not sure what your mean by that. As I understand it, one has to be able to provide, within 28 days, evidence that anything coded as C2/C1 on the initial EICR has been 'remedied'. I'm not sure that changes if a 'competent person' undertaking the remedial work doesn't believe that some of the C2/C1s coded by someone else actually require any 'remedy' (i.e. should not have been coded as they were).
Yes I realise I am in a very fortunate position but even more fortunately for others, the people I know do not actually treat me any different, realistically any landlord will get the same accurate report from them.
Sure, but the sad thing is that many landlords are going to (unwittingly) be stuck with inspectors rather different from the ones that you and I trust and could recommend. The worse thing of all is that most landlords will, understandably, not even realise that they are suffering (financially) at the hands of ('professional') people that they had assumed they could trust - the more decent/responsible of them will simply pay for what 'a professional' has indicated needs to be done, in the belief that they are acting in the interests of the safety of their tenants (as well as complying with the law).

As I've said many times, I think there is probably a need for those who undertake 'landlord EICRs' to be in some way 'licensed'/registered so to do. If that were the case, just as with MOT inspectors etc., if it were found that they were incompetent or, worse, were trying to 'invent work' for themselves, then their licence to undertake such EICRs could be revoked.

Kind Regards, John
 
In the context of the PRS legislation (at least, if one takes it literally), I'm not sure what your mean by that. As I understand it, one has to be able to provide, within 28 days, evidence that anything coded as C2/C1 on the initial EICR has been 'remedied'.
As I understand the system, and I'd genuinly prefer to be wrong on this one, documentation has to be attached to the original report to demontrate the 'fault has been rectified' and this can be in many forms, ie a broken socket simply requires a receipt for a replacement?
I'm not sure that changes if a 'competent person' undertaking the remedial work doesn't believe that some of the C2/C1s coded by someone else actually require any 'remedy' (i.e. should not have been coded as they were).Sure, but the sad thing is that many landlords are going to (unwittingly) be stuck with inspectors rather different from the ones that you and I trust and could recommend. The worse thing of all is that most landlords will, understandably, not even realise that they are suffering (financially) at the hands of ('professional') people that they had assumed they could trust - the more decent/responsible of them will simply pay for what 'a professional' has indicated needs to be done, in the belief that they are acting in the interests of the safety of their tenants (as well as complying with the law).
There will always be the work creation schemes, just like my dentist in the 60's who would always produce a list of problems at every visit, however all the time it is down to the opinion of the inspecter and not hard cold facts there is little we can do to avoid that problem other than your MOT analogy, which I'm in agreement with.
As I've said many times, I think there is probably a need for those who undertake 'landlord EICRs' to be in some way 'licensed'/registered so to do. If that were the case, just as with MOT inspectors etc., if it were found that they were incompetent or, worse, were trying to 'invent work' for themselves, then their licence to undertake such EICRs could be revoked.

Kind Regards, John
 
As I understand the system, and I'd genuinly prefer to be wrong on this one, documentation has to be attached to the original report to demontrate the 'fault has been rectified' and this can be in many forms, ie a broken socket simply requires a receipt for a replacement?
That is also my understanding.

Hence, as I said, if an electrician engaged to undertake the 'necessary' (per EICR) 'remedial work' does not believe that some of the items need any 'rectification', I don't see how one can satisfy the legislation with a demonstration that such (alleged) 'faults' actually have all 'been rectified', do you?

I assume that the bureaucrats concerned will simply compare the list of things that 'need to be rectified' (i.e. C2s & C1s on the EICR) with the list of things which 'have been rectified', wont they, and if they find that some things on the first list don't appear on the second, then I presume that they will conclude that the law hasn't been satisfied, won't they?

Kind Regards, John
 
Surely in that situation electrician number 2 could just issue a new satisfactory EICR. It will be virtually a copy and paste job from the EIC so is very little extra work.
 
Surely in that situation electrician number 2 could just issue a new satisfactory EICR. It will be virtually a copy and paste job from the EIC so is very little extra work.
Of course, but you are making the big mistake of 'talking common sense', whereas we are talking about 'the law' :)

I would like to be proved wrong, but the problem that we have often discussed here is that the legislation, as written, does not appear to allow a second EICR to negate the requirement to 'rectify' all C2s and C1s mentioned on the initial EICR (a copy of which has to be given to the tenant), no matter how silly or questionable those codings may be. In reality, I can envisage ways people might 'deal with' that situation, but not necessarily within the word of the law!

Kind Regards, John
 

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