Floor to ceiling book case

[Jupiter01]

Hi Guys,

I am planning to use one of these for all the joints:
https://www.screwfix.com/p/wolfcraf...ig/4643x#product_additional_details_container

Appreciate any views on the above. A couple of further questions please:
1. What size dowels should I use with the 18mm MDF?
2. How many dowels do you recommend for each section? I think I will be setting my bookcase to be 30cm wide

Thanks again

 

[Deleted member 174758]

1. What size dowels should I use with the 18mm MDF?

6 x 30 or better 8 x 30 or 8 x 40mm. Be careful not to drill the uprights too deeply

2. How many dowels do you recommend for each section? I think I will be setting my bookcase to be 30cm wide-

50mm to 60mm centres

Bookcases really need fixing back to the wall with angle brackets to prevent tipping

 

[Jupiter01]

8 x 40mm

With this I am guessing the upright should be 30mm and the horizontal piece 10mm?
Should I screw with Spax fittings too (where possible)?

50mm to 60mm centres

Around 5-6 dowels for each section of 300mm upright? I thought that may be excessive especially in tandem with screws. Please let me know.

Bookcases really need fixing back to the wall with angle brackets to prevent tipping

I was planning to fix galvanised L brackets in a number of sections and position them in a way that they are hidden by the books.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Jupiter01]

Good Evening,

Can someone please provide a steer on the above? Need some clarity on the dowels and use of screws please.

Thanks

 

[Deleted member 174758]

I think you would be better off using dowels, glue (D3 or D4 PVA) and clamps than screws and dowels if possible. Screw heads need to be filled and will almost always be visible even if you fill with 2-pack filler. Screws are also more likely to split the end "grain" of MDF unless carefully piloted and the pilot holes thoroughly cleaned out. If you must use screws then use as few as possible to pull the structure together before clamping it (say two per joint) - dowels and glue are stronger than screws are when done correctly

If you already have a jig why not make up a test box (well, 4 sides) with dowels, cramp or up and let it go off for 24 hours. Make a second one with screws alone. That way you'll see for yourself how much easier if is to make one than the other. You can try out your filling techniques on the test pieces as well before doing a destruction test to see which is the strongest. By doing that you may be able to determine for yourself which is best for you.

Don't underestimate how awkward this structure will be to construct /assemble and the need for an absolutely flat assembly area (possibly a couple of sheets of chipboard laid on the floor) to get it together without major issues

 

[Jupiter01]

For screws, it was suggested that spax screws are designed for MDF without pilot holes. I thought this may provide some extra strength?

 

[Deleted member 174758]

If you drill into the end grain of MDF without piloting and cleaning out the hole it will split, not always, but enough times to be an issue in terms of strength, and that's pretty much regardless of what make if screw you use.

I use Spax or Reissers when I get the chance plus for most private work I do, but whilst they are far better than cheap no-name or generic Timco screws they don't deliver miracles. Why not get a piece of MDF and try screwing in directly at different distances from the end with and without piloting? - but make sure that you are at least 25mm in from the end in any case

 

[Munroast]

I have a wall which is approximately 2.3m high and 3m wide. I’d like to build a decent looking bookcase in this space and need your advice please.

This is the type of look I want to achieve. Less the doors.

Firstly which wood should I build this in? I want to eventually paint it white and be using a wood which will be easy to maintain i.e. if it gets damaged, I should be able to fill, sand and paint.
Also want to avoid expansion/contraction as much as possible.

Secondly, is it worth cutting shelves slightly short of the total depth available to allow light to flow from the top, down through all the shelves?

Thirdly, does this have trims stuck on the face of all the wood to create the wide aesthetic look?

Thanks in advance.

are you appearing on TV and need a backdrop that makes you look intelligent?

 

[Jupiter01]

Thought I’d share some of my work in progress...

It’s been hard but enjoyable. Def not a walk in the park as I had thought from the outset. I’m hoping that now that I am getting use to the dowels and cutting, it should become easier.
I was planning to build a couple more layers whilst it’s in the garage and then move into the living room where I can build the rest of it in situ.

Please let me know if there are any other suggestions or flaw with my approach of wiring situ.

Thanks for your help

 

[Jupiter01]

but make sure that you are at least 25mm in from the end in any case

When I am drilling the joints together, it won’t be possible to be 25mm from the edge? How should I handle this?

Also, what size bit should I use for the pilot holes for a size 4 screw?

 

[Deleted member 174758]

When I am drilling the joints together, it won’t be possible to be 25mm from the edge? How should I handle this?,)

25mm in from the end of the individual pieces, not the sides. The holes need to be centred on the pieces, so 9mm in from the edges on 18mm thick stock, and 25mm in from the ends

...what size bit should I use for the pilot holes for a size 4 screw?

Do you mean a 4.0mm screw (the old imperial "size 4" or more correctly no. 4 or #4 screws are tiny)? If so I'd suggest getting yourself a Trend Snappy SNAP/CS/8 combined drill and countersink bit which drills and countersinks in one action. The #8 size drills 2.8mm hole. Costs about £7 to £8 on the net. Also worthwhile getting a couple of 2.8mm HSS twist drills as the pilot bits don't last forever.

 

[Jupiter01]

Do you mean a 4.0mm screw (the old imperial "size 4" or more correctly no. 4 or #4 screws are tiny)? If so I'd suggest getting yourself a Trend Snappy SNAP/CS/8 combined drill and countersink bit which drills and countersinks in one action. The #8 size drills 2.8mm hole. Costs about £7 to £8 on the net. Also worthwhile getting a couple of 2.8mm HSS twist drills as the pilot bits don't last forever.

I noted these screws based on a suggestion from this forum:


What size pilot bit do I need for this please?

 

[bsr]

As J&K says the theoretical size is 2.8mm. I'd use a 2.5mm which is much more widely available.

 

[Jupiter01]

I’ve never used the suggested bits. Should I get one of these and swap it out for a 2.5mm drill? I assume it’s possible to switch out the pilot bits...

https://www.screwfix.com/p/erbauer-...Wxmk-r53HVHl4yW-tbhoCSdwQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Thanks for your help guys

 

[Deleted member 174758]

As J&K says the theoretical size is 2.8mm. I'd use a 2.5mm which is much more widely available.

The 2.8mm drill bit comes with the Trend drill/countersink set. Trend sell replacement drill bits, but lots of people on eBay sell Heller and Milwaukee Thunderweb HSS twist drills in the right size. If you buy the Trend drill/countersink please don't do as suggested and replace the twist drill with 2.5mm ones - they make for a tighter hole (which means more risk of splitting) but also the Trend items are drilled to take a 2.8mm drill bit, so a 2.5mm one will be slightly off centre from the main body and will cause wobbling which can break the pilot bit prematurely. I suggested buying this tool because it really isn't that expensive against cheaper alternatives, and from experience with them I know that they are quick and relatively easy to use. Just using a pilot drill alone in MDF would also be asking for trouble as it can lead to splitting the "end grain" when driving the screw head home

The Erbauer bits are very poor in comparison with the Trend product, as are most other competitors (especially cheap Chinese ones). That Trend one is what I use on site for 4.0mm screws in MDF, chipboard, softwood and plywood. I've been using them for 10+ years now and never found a better product yet. You can get a tct version (SNAP/CS/8TC) as well ad a tct version with a revolving adjustable depth stop if required (SNAP/CSDS/8TC) which will give you consistent depth countersink holes, but that latter one is about £20 to £25 street price